Understanding Ye Olde Majesty's Law on ARs

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  • Curious

    Member
    Nov 30, 2020
    12
    Hi all,

    Sorry for my incompetence at using the search function if it's been covered before, I just wanted to clarify a few points because of how much MSP loves being ambiguous on our rights and because I love my dog and future dogs to come too much to risk it. For assembling an AR in MD, as far as I could find off of MSP and forums (still ambiguous), the HBAR rule only applies to centrefire semi-autos chambered in 5.56/.223, correct? An HBAR would not be required for an AR10 build or an "AR15" build chambered in something other than 5.56/.223, such as x39 or 5.45? I'm sure you vets are tired of answering this question over and over so sorry for being another imposing newbie.
     

    bigmancrisler

    2A Preacher
    Jun 4, 2020
    1,263
    Martinsburg, WV
    Hi all,

    Sorry for my incompetence at using the search function if it's been covered before, I just wanted to clarify a few points because of how much MSP loves being ambiguous on our rights and because I love my dog and future dogs to come too much to risk it. For assembling an AR in MD, as far as I could find off of MSP and forums (still ambiguous), the HBAR rule only applies to centrefire semi-autos chambered in 5.56/.223, correct? An HBAR would not be required for an AR10 build or an "AR15" build chambered in something other than 5.56/.223, such as x39 or 5.45? I'm sure you vets are tired of answering this question over and over so sorry for being another imposing newbie.


    Not legal advice, but yes from my understanding of it, it only has to be HBAR if it is an AR15 chambered in 556/223


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    ken792

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 2, 2011
    4,489
    Fairfax, VA
    HBAR also doesn’t apply for piston guns.

    It apparently also doesn’t apply for a KAC SR-15 since everything is proprietary.
     

    Curious

    Member
    Nov 30, 2020
    12
    Just to clarify- a friend informed me on .223 Wylde being capable of firing that, .223 Rem, and 5.56 all from the same barrel. Would being built for .223W be enough to circumvent the copycat ban?
     

    AssMan

    Meh...
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 27, 2011
    16,421
    Somewhere on the James River, VA
    Just to clarify- a friend informed me on .223 Wylde being capable of firing that, .223 Rem, and 5.56 all from the same barrel. Would being built for .223W be enough to circumvent the copycat ban?

    Also not legal advice...I'm not sure that anyone really knows, but I wouldn't push it that far personally. Seems like a no go.
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 22, 2009
    59,831
    Bel Air
    Just to clarify- a friend informed me on .223 Wylde being capable of firing that, .223 Rem, and 5.56 all from the same barrel. Would being built for .223W be enough to circumvent the copycat ban?

    Agree with snallygaster. I wouldn’t push it. .223 Wylde would be a no-go IMO.
     

    Curious

    Member
    Nov 30, 2020
    12
    Good idea, I'll stick to being safe. I'll probably just settle for an AR-10 since finding a complete AR-15 HBAR upper is basically an impossibility right now. I might also opt for an AR-9 as a range toy since I'm only ever going to be doing some plinking and don't expect to be going beyond 100 yds at the most (at which point the 10 is overkill as it is). Thanks for all the help, friends. I greatly appreciate it- as does my pooch.
     

    Matlack

    Scribe
    Dec 15, 2008
    8,557
    Also, its not circumventing a law. Its following the law. There are no loop holes, as the left puts it.
     

    Neutron

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Nov 20, 2014
    1,538
    severna park
    If all your using it for is plinking and a range toy, the AR9 would be a much better choice than the AR10. Ammo would be a lot less expensive under normal circumstances. It's very easy to go through those 30+ round mags when you're having fun.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    Just realize, the limitation to only .223/5.56 is a MSP construct and could change at any time.

    The list does not list caliber for ARs. But it does list caliber for other banned firearms.
     

    bigmancrisler

    2A Preacher
    Jun 4, 2020
    1,263
    Martinsburg, WV
    Good idea, I'll stick to being safe. I'll probably just settle for an AR-10 since finding a complete AR-15 HBAR upper is basically an impossibility right now. I might also opt for an AR-9 as a range toy since I'm only ever going to be doing some plinking and don't expect to be going beyond 100 yds at the most (at which point the 10 is overkill as it is). Thanks for all the help, friends. I greatly appreciate it- as does my pooch.


    Bear creek Arsenal typically has them in stock.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,728
    Just realize, the limitation to only .223/5.56 is a MSP construct and could change at any time.

    The list does not list caliber for ARs. But it does list caliber for other banned firearms.

    However, also please realize the LAW specifically says that to be considered a copy of a banned enumerated firearm it has to be completely parts interchangeable.

    Now, a DA can try to argue to a jury that an "AR-15" is also one that is in 6.5 Grendel with a bolt, magazine and barrel that will not allow it to fire .223/5.56x45mm ammunition. And you can swap those out, but then it doesn't function to fire the 6.5 Grendel ammunition you had built it as.

    DA is going to have a real hard time though getting a conviction when the state police have been saying various ARs in non-223 caliber are legit and fine.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    However, also please realize the LAW specifically says that to be considered a copy of a banned enumerated firearm it has to be completely parts interchangeable.

    Now, a DA can try to argue to a jury that an "AR-15" is also one that is in 6.5 Grendel with a bolt, magazine and barrel that will not allow it to fire .223/5.56x45mm ammunition. And you can swap those out, but then it doesn't function to fire the 6.5 Grendel ammunition you had built it as.

    DA is going to have a real hard time though getting a conviction when the state police have been saying various ARs in non-223 caliber are legit and fine.

    A NAMED banned firearm does not have to meet the copy requirements. It IS banned.

    The test would be if it is fully parts compatible with an AR in the same caliber.

    The MSP list and recommendations are NOT the law. They even state that on the web page of banned and not banned firearms.
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,728
    A NAMED banned firearm does not have to meet the copy requirements. It IS banned.

    The test would be if it is fully parts compatible with an AR in the same caliber.

    The MSP list and recommendations are NOT the law. They even state that on the web page of banned and not banned firearms.

    However an AR-15 is .223/5.56. ARs in other calibers are often called AR-15s, but aren’t.

    They aren’t fully parts compatible in most cases because if you, for example swapped a 6.5 Grendel bolt it won’t shoot .223. Or for that matter won’t shoot anything unless you swapped several other parts too.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    However an AR-15 is .223/5.56. ARs in other calibers are often called AR-15s, but aren’t.

    They aren’t fully parts compatible in most cases because if you, for example swapped a 6.5 Grendel bolt it won’t shoot .223. Or for that matter won’t shoot anything unless you swapped several other parts too.

    If they are marked AR-15, they are banned.

    This came up with the Federal ban, as many companies just changed the name of the firearm.

    But it all comes down to how MSP is enforcing the law. Which CAN change.
     

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