Darkemp
Ultimate Member
Never cancel a CMP order- they are always worth significantly more than you paid when or if you ever resell. You’ll make money.
Garand Tune-up
- Thread starter Ponder_MD
- Start date
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Never cancel a CMP order- they are always worth significantly more than you paid when or if you ever resell. You’ll make money.
You're right but I'd feel kind of slimey, flipping the rifle.
ken792
Ultimate Member
Blue Sky was an American company. They were based in Arlington, VA and had their warehouse in Winchester, VA. At some point, they reformed as Arlington Ordnance, with the same facilities.
The South Koreans received M1 Garands and M1 Carbines both as foreign military assistance loans (not to be confused with Lend Lease) and ones they purchased outright via foreign military sales. In the 80s, the US agreed to let the importers bring in a quantity equal to what the South Koreans had purchased by FMS. The remaining rifles were considered loaned US property and that was a point of contention when they tried to sell them off in recent years. Ultimately, the US State Dept wrote them off to become South Korean property, but still wouldn’t issue the retransfer waiver for US import. I’ve seen Korean marked M1 Carbines turn up with European dealers, so I guess they did get sold.
Blue Sky imports are generally considered worse than the Arlington Ordnance imports, possibly due to the Koreans selling off the worst ones first. Some say that the very deep stamping of the Blue Sky import marks distorted the barrels and made them keyhole, but the barrels could well have been just that badly worn. Arlington Ordnance import marks are small and light. There were certainly lots of trashed Arlington Ordnance rifles too, so that’s not a guarantee of a good rifle.
The South Koreans received M1 Garands and M1 Carbines both as foreign military assistance loans (not to be confused with Lend Lease) and ones they purchased outright via foreign military sales. In the 80s, the US agreed to let the importers bring in a quantity equal to what the South Koreans had purchased by FMS. The remaining rifles were considered loaned US property and that was a point of contention when they tried to sell them off in recent years. Ultimately, the US State Dept wrote them off to become South Korean property, but still wouldn’t issue the retransfer waiver for US import. I’ve seen Korean marked M1 Carbines turn up with European dealers, so I guess they did get sold.
Blue Sky imports are generally considered worse than the Arlington Ordnance imports, possibly due to the Koreans selling off the worst ones first. Some say that the very deep stamping of the Blue Sky import marks distorted the barrels and made them keyhole, but the barrels could well have been just that badly worn. Arlington Ordnance import marks are small and light. There were certainly lots of trashed Arlington Ordnance rifles too, so that’s not a guarantee of a good rifle.
kingfish
Active Member
- Jan 15, 2008
- 785
The Korean imports tended to have a more “silver” like parkerizing. Whenever I see a garand with that light grey or silverish finish, 90% of the time it’s a Korean import. The Korean ones also have lots of wear, typically. I think the heyday for garand buyers were the flood of Greek rifles and ammo. Those were overall very nice
As for maintenance, I have a set of headspace gauges and a book and a little bit of common sense. I’ve cleaned up triggers and gas tubes, wood fit, etc. I think it’s more fun and intimate to work in them myself. You really get to know the rifle and it’s parts much better
As for maintenance, I have a set of headspace gauges and a book and a little bit of common sense. I’ve cleaned up triggers and gas tubes, wood fit, etc. I think it’s more fun and intimate to work in them myself. You really get to know the rifle and it’s parts much better
Ok, I guess I didn't 100% comprehend what Charlie was telling me. I really think this rifle was beyond the kind of help that I could give it. Sure, I could probably do something with the trigger but headspace is not something I'm equipped to do right now.
Not to be cruel or crass but Charlie won't be around forever. I think the proper course of action for a rifle this bad, is to have him whip it into prime shape and then for me to take over as caretaker with the rifle at a known, good starting point. I'll buy gauges and tools and maintain it over the years. Frankly, I'm considering asking him if *after* he's completed my rifle if he'd like to continue my education.
Not to be cruel or crass but Charlie won't be around forever. I think the proper course of action for a rifle this bad, is to have him whip it into prime shape and then for me to take over as caretaker with the rifle at a known, good starting point. I'll buy gauges and tools and maintain it over the years. Frankly, I'm considering asking him if *after* he's completed my rifle if he'd like to continue my education.
Trepang
Ultimate Member
Thanks for posting a follow up report.
Glad you are getting it all straightened out.
Glad you are getting it all straightened out.
I'm among the lucky...Charlie reworked my Garand a couple of years ago. What a gentleman...what a true master!
Straightbolt
unindicted co-conspirator
Let us know what the final bill is....Some of us might want to get similar work done and need to know how much $ to have on hand
Doco Overboard
Ultimate Member
Maybe you can do a bolt/ barrel swap instead of writing off an otherwise decent shooter rifle. Bolt info is not golden but could get you where you need to be to close it up some based on samples.
Theirs folks who frequent the forum that have what you need and spare take offs/parts are frequently for sale on the cmp forum.
By the time its all said and done your probably going to want another rifle before its all done. They seem to multiply once you start on them anyhow.
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Augie
Ultimate Member
I bet when you get it back from Charlie it will become one of your favorite shooting rifles, Charlie builds excellent functioning and accurate rifles. I had him go over this one a few years ago and it's one of my favorite shooters.
https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=223283
I had the fortune to fire one of Charlie's rifles last month. It was nearly perfect right out of the box. A few clicks to get the windage right and the center of the target was missing. The rifle belongs to another forum member. He's the one who put me on to Charlie.
Doco, what's done is done. Maloney has the rifle and my money. When I get it back, the only thing left to be done will be to finish the wood with my choice of preservative.
Doco, what's done is done. Maloney has the rifle and my money. When I get it back, the only thing left to be done will be to finish the wood with my choice of preservative.
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Charlie's definitely confident about his work. When I picked up my rifle, included was a signed certificate by the master. There was no bragging, no bravado...just a piece of paper that he said would give confidence to anyone interested in obtaining it at a later date. Of course, with three grandsons, that concept is way down the road.
He is the M1 M-1a Man! Re did my M1,and he is very cool and knows his stuff. A very nice guy. You will be happy with it no doubt. Trigger work is GREAT!!
dist1646
Ultimate Member
Charlie probably will not teach his skills. He has been asked many times and the answer is always no. Given his age and health, I doubt that he would be able to give the time and attention he would consider necessary. Pick up a copy of The U.S. .30 Caliber gas operated Service Rifles, a shop manual volumes I & II by Jerry Kuhnhausen (it's one book), it contains a wealth of knowledge and is well worth what ever it costs. If you can, sign up for the CMP armorers course and later on, do their advanced course. BTW, Original gauges and tools are now collectable and expensive.
Sirex
Powered by natural gas
Charlie is a valuable resource to the M1 community that could never be replaced. The only problem I saw with him is, he is so good at what he does, he makes it look easy, lol. Kinda like when you watch one of those cooking shows, or infomercials selling cooking stuff, that make it look so easy afterwards you think you are a master chef.
But anyways, I bought a .308 M1, and was kinda worried about it, since it wasn't a CMP rifle. He changed the rear sight spring, gave it a trigger job, and shaved the stock a bit for clearance, as the op rod was rubbing (if I recall correctly). It passed all the gauges. He is a Garand master, and a nice guy to chat with.
But anyways, I bought a .308 M1, and was kinda worried about it, since it wasn't a CMP rifle. He changed the rear sight spring, gave it a trigger job, and shaved the stock a bit for clearance, as the op rod was rubbing (if I recall correctly). It passed all the gauges. He is a Garand master, and a nice guy to chat with.
Doco Overboard
Ultimate Member
Then you'll have a good one for sure evidently money well spent, and another from the cmp to boot maybe.
Next thing you know you'll have a whole pile of them and a barrel full of empty brass to sort through. To M1 spec M2 Spec deer hunting ammo, dummy rounds, blanks green and white tip frangible, tracer ......AP
Slings, en-blocs all over the place, Half bottles full of, BLO RLO ELO and REO and who knows what else. going on!
I spent about 4 hours with Charlie today. He went over both of my 30-06 Garand's and my .308 Garand.
The man is a flat out encyclopedia of knowledge. I had kicked around the idea of selling one '06 and the .308 to finance some other projects. After speaking with him and watching him tear these things apart, I decided to keep all of them.
This was, by far, some of the best money I've spent in a long time. I wish I had gone to see him sooner and now wish I had bought more rifles when I had bought these.
The man is a flat out encyclopedia of knowledge. I had kicked around the idea of selling one '06 and the .308 to finance some other projects. After speaking with him and watching him tear these things apart, I decided to keep all of them.
This was, by far, some of the best money I've spent in a long time. I wish I had gone to see him sooner and now wish I had bought more rifles when I had bought these.
- Aug 17, 2020
- 242
Hi, I been reading this thread, now I am wanting one. Any advice on where to buy a decent one at?
Thanks
Thanks
ken792
Ultimate Member
Trepang
Ultimate Member
Made an appointment with Charlie for next Monday.
He is gonna check out my 1943 SA and my buddies 1954 SA.
Debating on getting his trigger job.
He is gonna check out my 1943 SA and my buddies 1954 SA.
Debating on getting his trigger job.
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