Someone school me on Muzzleloaders

campns · Aug 16, 2019

I have an older TC Impact that i got on GB for $100 the new ones you don't need a wrench to pull the breach plug which is a nice feature. That being said if you can get an old used Omega they are the bee's knees. That being said i have often thought about getting an Encore so i can have my ol' single shot back with the ability to muzzle load, slap a 30/30, or 6.5 CM barrel and rock and roll.

I use BH 209 for my powder, Hordany sabots, and Rem 209 primers. you will have to experiment with any BP rifle to find what works for charge and sabots to not beat you up but give you the range and accuracy you desire.

Tomcat · Aug 16, 2019

Search the Hooligan shoot threads in the water cooler. 4570inMD and j8064 shoot a lot of BP. Here's one: https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?236697&p=5611344#post5611344

bikerbankr · Aug 16, 2019

I picked up a CVA Optima V2 package deal that came with a Konus 3-9x scope and a CVA branded case for $299 from Cabela's two years ago. Read some complaints about the scope not holding a zero but it's been dead-on from day one for me. I've only been hunting for 3 years but I took my first, and only, deer with the CVA. Saw 2 deer in my first year but a combination of minor equipment malfunction and adrenaline caused two misses..

Took it to the range and it was almost perfect out of the box. I experimented with 777 pellets and White Hot pellets along with 295gr PowerBelt bullets and some 245gr TC's. Tried Remington Kleen-bore primers and one other brand (CCI maybe?).

In any case, I was shooting groups of 2" or less at 100yds no matter what brand pellet, primer and bullet I used. 2 pellets (100gr) every time and the 245's did shoot a bit higher than the 295's but I don't think the difference would matter inside 100yds.

While I prefer hunting with a rifle, all the public land close to me is shotgun-only. I like the CVA so much I bring it out instead of the 12Ga now.

remrug · Aug 16, 2019

For a first timer,a CVA Wolf is hard to beat.I know 3 people who have them.They are all accurate,affordable and easy to take apart and clean.The only reason I dont have one is I bought a Remington the first year they came out.It a total PIA to clean,but I have shot so many deer with it,I am kind of attatched to it....lol.

bg71361 · Aug 16, 2019

bg71361 · Aug 16, 2019

Woops

lazarus · Aug 16, 2019

Speed3 said:
That is a great offer that you should take up. Each person is different sizes, stocks fit differently, etc.

I have a TC Omega, that is 10+ years old. Shoots wonderful, cloverleaf at 100 yards.

I've noticed that deer shot with the muzzle loader tend to not drop and run further than with a bow/rifle. Guessing the bullet(tipped HP) and the slow speeds have something to do with it.

Good luck in your search. For me...the inline 209's are the way to go. Simple and most are easy to clean.

Further than a rifle maybe, but bow no. Now my heart shot deer ran surprisingly far. Maybe 100yds missing most of its heart. The other two, the spined one dropped right there and was dead by the time I reloaded and walked the 70yds over to it. Blew some slivers of bone in to the lungs and bleed out from all the major vessels severed along the spine. The first one double lung it spun and leaped off. It dropped in less than 20yds.

Granted I’ve only shot one with a bow, but it was a perfect double lung and it ran about 120yds easy.

Most stories I hear of guys losing deers or taking hours to find them far away are from bow. Occasionally a bad rifle or ML shots

mcbruzdzinski · Aug 16, 2019

Inigoes said:
A black powder class is coming up, and it's free

https://register-ed.com/events/view/133606

Will there be another date for the class? I would like to take it but will out of town that weekend.

aht2131 · Aug 17, 2019

I hunted ML for the first time last year with a used CVA Wolf. I am really happy with it, and ended up with a few deer for the freezer. With 2 pellets of 777 I am confident it will be good enough for anything 150yd or less, although all of the shots I have taken are well under 100. I used Hornady SST bullets and they were very effective. Its also really easy to clean, I just take out the breach plug and pour hot water down the barrel and run a patch through it after. Takes but a minute or two. Its definitely one of the best value to price guns.

Jollyllama · Aug 17, 2019

Tha is for all the info. I picked up a CVA optima from a member that I am going to try out.

Also some excellent offers that I will probably take folks up on to check other options out down the road.

Appreciate it MDS!

wilcam47 · Aug 19, 2019

I somehow have ended up with 4 muzzle loaders...LOL. latest one is a CVA wolf northwest edition since we can use 209primers here. I like it thus far. I also have a Thompson that has killed numerous deer.

Speed3 · Aug 19, 2019

lazarus said:
Granted I’ve only shot one with a bow, but it was a perfect double lung and it ran about 120yds easy.

My experience is different, maybe I'm just lucky. I think the furthest I've had a bow shot run is maybe 80 yards. I've had some that walked 10 yards and got the death wobble. I'd say most were with in 50 yards for me.

Melnic · Aug 19, 2019

FYI,
This is my simple GOTO load for CVA Wolf or CVA optima. worked great on both m CVA wolf and Optima. My dad also uses that on his CVA wolf then his Optima when he upgraded.

2 White Hots and Traditions SST Smackdown 50 cal or Thompson Center Shockwave (I've shot both out to 200 yards and POI are were the same)

Things I found:
Let barrrel cool between shots.
Final test is to shoot with a cool clean barrel the same you will hunt with.
If you get a CVA, pull all the scope screws and blue locktite (don't forget the base)
Green Powerbelts are find for less than 50 yards but accuracy is poor out beyond that.

Thats the EASY load.

I got the BH209 breach plug and switched to that. 100gr was great and slightly better accuracy and less sensitivity to cool clean barrel. Not sure its worth the effort to go to BH209 if you are staying < 100 yards.

Inigoes · Aug 19, 2019

mcbruzdzinski said:
Will there be another date for the class? I would like to take it but will out of town that weekend.

I really do not know. The last class that I know of was a few years ago.

Mag Dump · Aug 21, 2019

Jollyllama said:
I am very familiar with black powder revolvers.

Never had a blackpowder rifle. It’s one thing I really know very little about and before doing my dive down the research rabbit hole, I was thinking I’d ask advice first.

Interested in obtaining one, nothing too nice but not junk.

Familiar with the brand names but not their reputation or features. I’ve been looking at the CVA Optima V2.... any suggestions there would be appreciated.

I don’t know exactly what to look for in them, the pros and cons of each kind.

I do know I’m interested in an inline.

Help me out?

Thanks in advance!

I know you said nothing too nice and that you are primarily interested in an inline, but . . .

Take a peek at these. Even if you decide these are too top end and you still want an inline, perhaps checking out functional works of art like these will help inform your search for what you might want to get.

Jim Chambers Flintlocks
https://www.flintlocks.com

They are making me a Christians Spring -Edward Marshall right now. Should be done by ML season!

lazarus · Aug 23, 2019

Melnic said:
FYI,
This is my simple GOTO load for CVA Wolf or CVA optima. worked great on both m CVA wolf and Optima. My dad also uses that on his CVA wolf then his Optima when he upgraded.

2 White Hots and Traditions SST Smackdown 50 cal or Thompson Center Shockwave (I've shot both out to 200 yards and POI are were the same)

Things I found:
Let barrrel cool between shots.
Final test is to shoot with a cool clean barrel the same you will hunt with.
If you get a CVA, pull all the scope screws and blue locktite (don't forget the base)
Green Powerbelts are find for less than 50 yards but accuracy is poor out beyond that.

Thats the EASY load.

I got the BH209 breach plug and switched to that. 100gr was great and slightly better accuracy and less sensitivity to cool clean barrel. Not sure its worth the effort to go to BH209 if you are staying < 100 yards.

It is. My opinion after finally switching. I’ve had 777 go bad and shoot for crap after less than 2 years. Plus not needing to swab every shot or two is nice. Not worrying about bore corrosion because I fired a shot and reloaded right away while hunting is also nice.

IMHO I don’t clean it after sight-in and before hunting. I clean at the end of the season or if I shoot a lot of shots at the range. Swab every 20 or so shots is what I do. Clean with smokeless cleaning products at the end of the hunting season.

With 777 and pyrodex it means cleaning at the end of the day if I took a shot and reloaded while hunting. PITB.

willtill · Aug 23, 2019

I've never seen 777 go bad. I've used like two pounds of it for a few years stored. Maybe it's the way it's stored?

My load in my TC Arms Omega is 90gr 777 and a 250gr TC Arms Shockwave. Very accurate and repeatable. I swab between shots.

.

marko · Aug 23, 2019

I happened to be in Bass Pro Shop when the CVA rep was there. I have an Optima which has killed 10 deer I guess.
It's got a Nikon 4x90 scope, all original boxes and paperwork.
He told me to put 2 Pyrodex pellets in and a 270 grain powerbelt platinum bullet.
It works, and I have been meaning to sell it, we lost the farm we had hunted for 20 years.

Derwood · Aug 28, 2019

I have a Thompson Center Hawken in .50cal and I LOVE IT. I think they stopped making them about ten years ago but they're readily available. I got mine about five years ago.

I load it with 90 grains of powder and shoot Thompson Center Maxi Balls. I can put three in a 3" group at 100 yards. I've taken three deer with it. None of them ran far.

...And no, I don't ALWAYS wear my trapper capote coat when I hunt with it! I only wear that when it's cold enough.

I think you've basically got to decide if you want to have a "traditional" muzzle loading rifle, or a modern one. The modern models come with modern conveniences like breach loading. The traditional ones will force you to learn traditional skill sets and are practically indestructible. They also make you feel like a real badass mountain main while using them.

But I didn't want to make that choice. I had a strong desire to get a traditional model, but I also had a strong desire to cleanly kill any deer I pointed it at. So my 1820's model rifle has a modern scope on it. So I get a little bit of a modern advantage with the optic. I think that's fair since I can only hunt one or two times each muzzle loader season, so I've got to make each outing count. A lot of people think it's an abomination to have a scope on it but I love it...and I'm sure Griz and Jeremiah would approve!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawken_rifle

wilcam47 · Aug 28, 2019

Derwood said:
I have a Thompson Center Hawken in .50cal and I LOVE IT. I think they stopped making them about ten years ago but they're readily available. I got mine about five years ago.

I load it with 90 grains of powder and shoot Thompson Center Maxi Balls. I can put three in a 3" group at 100 yards. I've taken three deer with it. None of them ran far.

...And no, I don't ALWAYS wear my trapper capote coat when I hunt with it! I only wear that when it's cold enough.

I think you've basically got to decide if you want to have a "traditional" muzzle loading rifle, or a modern one. The modern models come with modern conveniences like breach loading. The traditional ones will force you to learn traditional skill sets and are practically indestructible. They also make you feel like a real badass mountain main while using them.

But I didn't want to make that choice. I had a strong desire to get a traditional model, but I also had a strong desire to cleanly kill any deer I pointed it at. So my 1820's model rifle has a modern scope on it. So I get a little bit of a modern advantage with the optic. I think that's fair since I can only hunt one or two times each muzzle loader season, so I've got to make each outing count. A lot of people think it's an abomination to have a scope on it but I love it...and I'm sure Griz and Jeremiah would approve!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawken_rifle

we have some dumb laws here in idaho. No sabots, no scopes, no 209 primers. caps must be "open to the air"..., no pellets. Only loose powder :sad20:

Someone school me on Muzzleloaders

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