Personally I wouldn't GAF. If his wife can legally buy the gun and the FFL is selling it to her, then why is that your problem? If I sell a gun to a dude through the legal route, he passes the background stuff, the FFL transfers the gun to him, he then goes on a killing spree. How is that my fault, or even the FFL's? Once the FFL has possession and legally transfers the gun to someone, it's on his head at that point not yours. Just my .02.
Could this be considered straw purchase?
- Thread starter seawalker
- Start date
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If there is a email trail , it would be very hard to claim you were dumb and you did not know what was going on . Once you have been notified by email then you know , i would remove myself from the equation IMHO
Like I said, if the wife is buying it and she can legally own it, then if she gives it to her "disapproved, not approved" husband, how is that your fault? She is breaking the law not you.
The guy sounds like a moron and shouldn't have told you anything other than who the gun was being transferred to.
Can I not buy a gun for my wife? I can pay for it and it will be hers, but then can't I shoot it if I am allowed to posses a firearm? It'll be registered to her.
I think a true straw purchase would be buying a gun legally and then selling it illegally to a person not allowed to possess it. Or, like in MD now, selling a gun and not using an FFL is illegal but would that be a straw purchase?
Eh whatever floats your boat.
With the way the government goes after "everyone" once something bad happens (long shot) is what i would be fearful of .
All of this is a longshot for sure but once it gets complicated on a gun sale i would more then likely bail . That is me others are welcome to move in a different direction .
There is BGOS and there is morality.
The anti’s would have such a good time with this thread. They wouldn’t have to twist far to make the whole community look bad.
“When faced with a situation where there are hints MDS members were selling a gun to a prohibited person, 4 out of 5 say it is up to the FFL to figure it out”.
The anti’s would have such a good time with this thread. They wouldn’t have to twist far to make the whole community look bad.
“When faced with a situation where there are hints MDS members were selling a gun to a prohibited person, 4 out of 5 say it is up to the FFL to figure it out”.
If the background check is delayed, why is there a problem in waiting for it to be resolved? Just tell the buyer to wait until the final word comes through.
Also, people usually don't start the background check unless they are processing the 4473 and state required forms, and these don't start until the gun is in the FFL's hand. So, did you send the gun to the FFL already? If so, you can't do anything, the FFL has to decide if he will change the buyer to the guy's wife (potential straw purchase from the sound of it) or send the gun back to you.
This is correct, but I doubt that many of the experts on this thread will accept that.
Does a wholesaler care who the retail FFL ends up selling a gun that the wholesaler did in fact used to own? No.
The act of a "straw purchase" happens between the FFL and the buyer (the person standing in the store, filling out line 9 on the 4473.) You are shipping your firearm to the FFL dealer who takes possession of the firearm by logging it into his bound book. At that point, the FFL "owns" the gun and it's on him to transfer it in a lawful manner, to a non-prohibited person.
- Jul 29, 2014
- 49,983
So in this case, who actually pays for the gun? The proposed buyer or the FFL?
What happens in the event that the FFL suspects an attempted straw purchase of said weapon, and then refuses the sale? Meantime, the original seller has his money(?), the FFL is stuck with the gun(?), and the prospective buyer is out the cost of the gun?
Or does the original seller not get paid until the successful transfer of the gun to a buyer is completed.
All these BOGOS comments don't really help clarify the situation.
bratgirllcp
Ultimate Member
OP I never sold a gun but just reading your post I feel red flags there will be other buyers stay safe
Biggfoot44
Ultimate Member
- Aug 2, 2009
- 33,137
When all else fails , receiving FFL returns tp sender . Recieving FFL probably eats the return shipping . If the attempted buyer thinks they have a claim against the attempted seller , they can either ask , or sue in attempted seller's state .
Yes , this is messy and hassle for recieving FFL
That's why they charge a meaningful transfer fee .
Yes ,if attempted seller was private person , it is further trickier for recieving FFL to contact attempted seller for FFL arriangements on their end . This is why some FFL don't accept shipment from private person , or only do so selectively .
Yes , this is messy and hassle for recieving FFL
That's why they charge a meaningful transfer fee .
Yes ,if attempted seller was private person , it is further trickier for recieving FFL to contact attempted seller for FFL arriangements on their end . This is why some FFL don't accept shipment from private person , or only do so selectively .
I would pass on changing the order information as well. Ultimately, the FFL is responsible for anything beyond that.
I would also point out that buying a gun as ‘a gift’ is not a straw purchase. Specific examples of what qualifies as a gift are given in the 4473 instructions.
I would also point out that buying a gun as ‘a gift’ is not a straw purchase. Specific examples of what qualifies as a gift are given in the 4473 instructions.
Doc, I think you've brought it home that while the proposed transaction may be lawful if judged in a court of law, it may not hold up as well in the court of public opinion, which is where unfriendly legislators get their inspiration and motivation to keep chipping away at our rights.
What would Brian Frosh's press release say if (on the admittedly very rare chance) the gun got used in the commission of a crime?
As someone relatively new to this.
How does the buyer know his/her background check will be delayed? When someone fills out a 4473 . . . they may suspect the background check will be rejected but why would they think it would be delayed? What would be the circumstances to think your background check would be delayed?
How does the buyer know his/her background check will be delayed? When someone fills out a 4473 . . . they may suspect the background check will be rejected but why would they think it would be delayed? What would be the circumstances to think your background check would be delayed?
So I told the buyer that I was uncomfortable changing the name over to his wife and that I didn’t want to be liable for anything. Even if it’s ok for me to transfer to his wife, I Agree with others that he gave me TMI in an email trail. He replied that he understood and respected my reasons.
He says the reason for the delay is that he is Canadian, and a permanent resident here. And that his FFL is out of town, but has his paperwork. Sounds to me like the FFL is a friend of his or something. Otherwise Why not just use another one? I did look up the license number and it checks out at least.
I thought the buyer was supposed to start the background check once I shipped the gun to his FFL? But, I guess I could give him some time to see if the check goes through. I told him to hold off sending payment because I don’t want to send the gun and have it sent back again.
He says the reason for the delay is that he is Canadian, and a permanent resident here. And that his FFL is out of town, but has his paperwork. Sounds to me like the FFL is a friend of his or something. Otherwise Why not just use another one? I did look up the license number and it checks out at least.
I thought the buyer was supposed to start the background check once I shipped the gun to his FFL? But, I guess I could give him some time to see if the check goes through. I told him to hold off sending payment because I don’t want to send the gun and have it sent back again.
PowPow
Where's the beef?
Delay could be as simple as having a name in common with a prohibited person. People with clearances sometimes have issues. The guys I know who've been delayed once tend to experience delays again. That's why someone might think it would be delayed.
Good points. Good perspective. Thanks!
The Anti’s need nothing more than “Blah Blah sold a gun blah blah” to smear you as anti-science and a white supremacist. The fact that no one on MDS even suggested forgoing a background check will be completely ignored by them.
