Best handgun reloading manual?

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

Traveler said:
Do what you want, but don't get new reloaders in to trouble with wrong information.

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-education/reloading-beginners/primer-seating-depth

You are telling people to FORCE the primer BELOW flush, which is NOT required by your very own post.
I can see the words YOU highlighted, but, That does NOT change the meanings of the words in the sentence, does it.

IF it is raining, put on your raincoat or YOU WILL GET WET. Do you still get wet if it is NOT raining? I highlighted the Right words.

IDEAL = Best practice, obviously NOT REQUIRED or the IF would NOT be there. I am not giving out dangerous information, if you follow the Quote you just listed, it is OK to have flush primers.
The VAST majority of Slam Fires are from POOR gun maintenance. The firing pin is proud of the bolt face and hits the primer first.

Again, please take the time to read you own post.
"If it fails to fire, sometimes a SECOND strike is required to get it to go off."

So that means that the energy from the firing pin strike has seated the primer WITHOUT upsetting the anvil enough to make it go off. So how much energy can be imparted on the primer by the bolt face hitting it across it's entire surface? Just pushing on it does not upset the anvil inside.

PLEASE NOTE: I am NOT saying to load with the primer proud of the case, FLUSH is acceptable.

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

Just a general note about Quoting articles:
Please quote the entire article, NOT just the part that makes you look smart.

Thia is the entire quote you linked:

Primer seating depth – how far the primer is inserted into the shell case – is carefully controlled in factory ammunition. You also need to be aware of primer seating depth when reloading. Seating the primer too deep below flush can damage the internal components, leading to misfires and inconsistent ignition. Seating the primer too high (above flush) can cause the cylinder to not rotate in revolvers, and can cause problems when the bolt slams home in semi-autos. Seating above flush can also result in misfires.

Unless you are reloading on a progressive machine (each pull of the handle yields a loaded cartridge), the primer seating depth is controlled by feel as the primer is inserted. This is especially true if you are using a handheld priming tool. The primer seating depth is best checked with your finger tip. Sliding the index finger across the bottom of the primed shell case will quickly determine if the primer is above or below flush.

The ideal seating depth is just below flush. As you gain experience in loading, the feel to accomplish this will become familiar. It is best to use your finger to test every primed shell case. If the primer is above flush it can be run through the seating operation again to push it below flush. QUOTE

Maybe the entire article reads a little different than some of the KNOW-IT-ALLS would like to admit?

coopermania · Apr 13, 2014

kalister1 said:
The VAST majority of Slam Fires are from POOR gun maintenance. The firing pin is proud of the bolt face and hits the primer first.

PLEASE NOTE: I am NOT saying to load with the primer proud of the case, FLUSH is acceptable.

Slam fires are from poor maintenance ??
I guessing you don't own any open bolt fixed firing pin semi or full autos firearms then ?

And yes you did say that high ( proud ) primers were ok.

[QUOTE=kalister1;3142275]I took FTF as Failure to FEED, FTE as failure to extract.

The primer should be fully seated in the hole.
If it is not, it will depend on how much energy the firing exerts on the primer.
I agree that the anvil needs to upset to ignite, it will depend on the firing pin energy if a primer that is NOT seated will ignite or not.
It depends on the exact dimensions of the primer and the primer pocket of the cartridge to determine if the fully seated primer will be proud, flush or below flush.[/QUOTE]

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

coopermania said:
Slam fires are from poor maintenance ??
I guessing you don't own any open bolt fixed firing pin semi or full autos firearms then ?

And yes you did say that high ( proud ) primers were OK.

[QUOTE=kalister1;3142275]I took FTF as Failure to FEED, FTE as failure to extract.

The primer should be fully seated in the hole.
If it is not, it will depend on how much energy the firing exerts on the primer.
I agree that the anvil needs to upset to ignite, it will depend on the firing pin energy if a primer that is NOT seated will ignite or not.
It depends on the exact dimensions of the primer and the primer pocket of the cartridge to determine if the fully seated primer will be proud, flush or below flush.[/QUOTE]

Please show me where I said they are OK to shoot. You quoted the part that explained WHY a primer could be proud.
When I posted that FLUSH was OK, you said I was dangerous.

Go back and read my first post and your reply. Then read the entire article that was quoted saying I am dangerous. Too low = BAD & Too high = (ABOVE FLUSH) So FLUSH IS OK!
Then tell me who is wrong!
Fixed firing pin guns do NOT need a Proud primer to fire Out of Battery, if the case fails to fully seat in the chamber that can cause OOB fire also.
I did not know the OP's GLOCK pistol was a Full Auto open bolt gun!

Traveler · Apr 13, 2014

kalister1 said:
Again, please take the time to read you own post.
"If it fails to fire, sometimes a SECOND strike is required to get it to go off."

I do this for safety reasons. I want the cartridge to go off safely. If it won't I have to take it back and break it down with a kinetic bullet puller. I prefer leaving my reloading mistakes on the bench. I don't want them ever getting to the range.

To be clear, I recommend you purchase at least two reputable reloading manuals, and follow their instructions.

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

coopermania said:
I often find it funny and interesting that you can show some.' know it all's ' all the manufacters information you want and they still know more than the people that make it.

First: you did NOT show any information at all!
Second: the information shown shows you are WRONG!

Who is this "Know it all" you are talking about?

coopermania · Apr 13, 2014

kalister1 said:
I took FTF as Failure to FEED, FTE as failure to extract.

The primer should be fully seated in the hole.
If it is not, it will depend on how much energy the firing exerts on the primer.
I agree that the anvil needs to upset to ignite, it will depend on the firing pin energy if a primer that is NOT seated will ignite or not.
It depends on the exact dimensions of the primer and the primer pocket of the cartridge to determine if the fully seated primer will be proud, flush or below flush.[/QUOTE]

kalister1 said:

Please show me where I said they are OK to shoot. You quoted the part that explained WHY a primer could be proud.
When I posted that FLUSH was OK, you said I was dangerous.

Go back and read my first post and your reply. Then read the entire article that was quoted saying I am dangerous. Too low = BAD & Too high = (ABOVE FLUSH) So FLUSH IS OK!
Then tell me who is wrong!
Fixed firing pin guns do NOT need a Proud primer to fire Out of Battery, if the case fails to fully seat in the chamber that can cause OOB fire also.
I did not know the OP's GLOCK pistol was a Full Auto open bolt gun!

Click to expand...

I guess you missed your point of you stating a fully seated primer maybe PROUD , FLUSH
OR BELOW FLUSH.
Don't change in the middle of a discussion.

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

kalister1 said:
For FTF get yourself a "CASE GAGE" or whatever it's called?
It is a precision machined piece of steel that is the correct diameter for the cartridge you are checking. If the cartridge drops in and fits (Not too long, Flush primer) it SHOULD chamber in ANY firearm of that caliber.
For my 40 S&W I bought an UNDER SIZE (- .001") sizing die and that cured all my FTF problems.

coopermania said:
A correctly seated primer is not flush sir, A correctly seated primer is a seated a few thousands ' DEEPER ' than flush. You need to seat the anvil and arm the primer.
It is most likely one of the problems the OP is having already.

coopermania said:
kalister1 said:

I took FTF as Failure to FEED, FTE as failure to extract.

The primer should be fully seated in the hole.
If it is not, it will depend on how much energy the firing exerts on the primer.
I agree that the anvil needs to upset to ignite, it will depend on the firing pin energy if a primer that is NOT seated will ignite or not.
It depends on the exact dimensions of the primer and the primer pocket of the cartridge to determine if the fully seated primer will be proud, flush or below flush.[/QUOTE]

I guess you missed your point of you stating a fully seated primer maybe PROUD , FLUSH
OR BELOW FLUSH.
Don't change in the middle of a discussion.

Click to expand...

Talking about changing the subject.
I said FLUSH, you said no, Flush is WRONG!

Again, please show me where I said it is OK to shoot?
That is my point exactly, if it is fully seated and still proud, you want him to shove it in deeper, that is BAD.
If it is proud, do not shoot it and either remove it or soak it in oil. No where did I mention shooting a proud primer. Please quote where I said it was OK to Shoot!
I can show you where you said Flush is bad.

Who is this "Know it all" you refer to?

coopermania · Apr 13, 2014

I am going to plow the garden.

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

good luck

coopermania · Apr 13, 2014

Oh and I did say Flush is bad.. Ever wonder why on 5.56 ammo the primers sit so deep in the pocket ?
Those pesky floating firing pins sure do like that 3 to 8+ thou worth of extra room when the primer is seated in the bottom of the pocket.

Seeya. John Deere time.

Mooseman · Apr 13, 2014

3% of my primers are flush. :innocent0

Uncle Duke · Apr 13, 2014

JettaRed said:
I'm looking for a manual that will help you problem solve your reloads, such as FTF, FTE, etc. Thanks.

I am shooting a GLOCK G19 Gen4.

OP,

If you're like most folks who are motivated to learn the reloading craft, you'll already have spent thousands of dollars over your shooting career on firearms, ammunition and related supplies. But what you'll see as a recurring theme with many and most new folks is that they get laser focused on what press and what supplies and what components and what accessories to buy. Ironically enough, your cheapest and your best and your most valuable expenditure is the one most oftentimes overlooked. That component is your understanding. That understanding comes from your library of industry certified information.

In my opinion, your very first reloading purchase should be a copy of The ABC's of Reloading. ABC's differs from reloading manuals. You won't find load data there. What you will find is an overview of ammunition generally, and the inter-relationship between ammunition and the firearm in which the ammunition will be used. You didn't manufacture your firearm. But you'll most certainly be quite literally manufacturing your ammunition. ABC's will help you to begin to understand just exactly what you'll need to be doing in your manufacturing processes, and why you need to be doing what it is that you're doing. Many if not most new reloaders tend to skip this important step. Many if not most reloaders also tend to be largely self taught. Which means you're in many ways on your own.

If you want to learn this craft well, don't skip this step. For less than the cost of a box of ammo, and a drop in the bucket in terms of your overall expenditures, read this book. Then read it again. It will arm you with a number of answers. Perhaps more importantly, it will guide you in terms of what questions to ask regarding the topic generally. You set into motion a LOT of very interesting and a lot of very powerful dynamics when you squeeze a trigger. Learn and enjoy finding out what those dynamics are. Because ultimately, you're the manufacturer of your own reloading success or failure. Be well armed. Your understanding is the key component to your success. Also the least expensive!

Good luck!

coopermania · Apr 13, 2014

Mooseman said:
3% of my primers are flush.

Hahahahaahahhahahahahahhahahahaaahahhhahaahahahahahahahahahahahahhhaahahahhhaaaahhahaahhhhahahahahaahahahhhahhhhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahaahahahahahhhahaahha

SLUGMANNNNNNNNNNNNNN

. That's funny stuff

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

Mooseman said:
3% of my primers are flush.

Please let me know where you shoot, you are dangerous.

kalister1 · Apr 13, 2014

While we are back on the subject. Please look at this website and tell me where you get the idea that primers MUST be seated below flush.

It seems the INDUSTRY STANDARD drawings do NOT agree with some Know-IT-Alls.

http://ballistictools.com/articles/primer-pocket-depth-and-diameter.php

Not to beat a dead horse, but, what the hell, why not?

Hickory · Apr 13, 2014

manuals

I'm looking for a manual that will help you problem solve your reloads, such as FTF, FTE, etc. Thanks.

If you continue to reload, you will eventually end up with many manuals. Over the years I started with Nonte's Basic Handloading and have added Speer, Lyman, Lee, Sierra, Nosler and T/C Contender manuals but you don't have to get them all at once. I recently found some basic Lyman booklets at Mid-South Shooters Supply for specific calibers for around $6 each. One was for auto pistols in 380 Auto, 9mm Luger, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP while the other was for revolvers in 38 Special, 357 Magnum, 44 Magnum, and 45 Colt. Each "mini" manual has around 29 pages of general information (including primer seating

) prior to listing actual loads in another 30+ pages.
BTW, you didn't mention if you are only loading for the Glock. Something not mentioned in the discussions here is your crimping method. Since auto cases headspace on the case mouth you must use taper crimping only. A roll crimp with autos will lead to many issues, none of them good.

Magnumite · Apr 14, 2014

I am assuming this G4 Glock 19 shoots okay with factory ammo. That should be established first.

Others have given good info. Uncle Duke hit the nail on the head in understanding how the gun and ammo work together. You can then assess the nature of your load malfunctions. Example, if the slide seems to be just dribbling brass out when it does function, it would indicate inadequate slide momentum since the brass isn't being thrown out of the gun. That would incicate inadquate energy imparted to the slide. Again, this would assume the gun functions with factory ammo.

Good luck, reloading is a whole new aspect of this sport.

DaemonAssassin · Apr 14, 2014

Mooseman said:
3% of my primers are flush.

kalister1 said:
Mooseman said:

3% of my primers are flush.

Click to expand...

Please let me know where you shoot, you are dangerous.

If you weren't around for the Slugman fiasco, then you wouldn't understand the joke. He isn't being serious about what he said, he was poking fun at something that has become a long running joke, just like "Check back in 2 weeks" is a joke in the legislation areas.

DaemonAssassin · Apr 14, 2014

kalister1 said:
While we are back on the subject. Please look at this website and tell me where you get the idea that primers MUST be seated below flush.

It seems the INDUSTRY STANDARD drawings do NOT agree with some Know-IT-Alls.

http://ballistictools.com/articles/primer-pocket-depth-and-diameter.php

Not to beat a dead horse, but, what the hell, why not?

I don't think there is anything left of the horse... :sad20:

Best handgun reloading manual?

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