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    Senior Keyboard Operator
    Feb 10, 2007
    2,704
    Just noticed in another thread va shot down a bill to allow ccw in restaurants but you could open carry. Could anyone give a quick plain language summary of concealed carry guidelines in PA and VA?
     

    gamer_jim

    Podcaster
    Feb 12, 2008
    13,233
    Hanover, PA
    I don't know much about VA but earlier this year the wife and I thought we would be moving to PA but due to the stupid economy we probably won't now.

    But I did read up on their laws so here is how I understand PAs:

    To transport a loaded firearm in a car you must have a LTCF permit. Otherwise it has to follow federal guidelines of being unloaded and holstered.

    LTCF permits are issued on a "shall issue" basis by the local county's sheriff's office. I think it's $90 or so, but not positive. From what I have read permits are available between 2-5 weeks after submission.

    A sheriff can revoke your permit for almost any reason. There is an appeals process but from what I've read there have been some unjustified cases that were upheld by the court.

    You can carry just about anywhere in PA except court houses. Court houses are supposed to have lockers where you can secure your weapon but I've read stories about people getting crap from security there because they don't like armed citizens.

    You can carry in restaurants, even ones that sell alcohol, but the limit as to how much you can drink while carrying is arbitrary and up to the arresting officer. I read a story where a guy had exactly 1 beer but the cop didn't like armed citizens and arrested him for drinking while carrying. Moral of the story: you shouldn't be drinking ANYTHING if you are carrying anyway.

    Businesses cannot "ban guns" from the premises. They have to ask you to leave on an individual basis and if you don't leave you can get arrested for trespass. The "no guns" signs don't really hold any water and as long as your concealed the business owner won't know.

    I've read a few horror stories of people getting harassed by cops for carrying. Mostly for Open Carrying but a few for concealed too. It seems that some cops don't understand the laws in PA. I highly recommend printing out the brochure with the PA statutes on it so you can educate anyone that questions your right to carry.

    PA has a law where local municipalities cannot restrict your gun rights any further then what the state has. For example, one city owned park had a "no guns" sign that was placed there by the city council. If the city had their own police they would attempt to arrest you if you had a gun on there. Of course it would be an illegal arrest but a hassle and costly nevertheless.

    For a non-resident, supposedly it is legal for you to carry concealed if you have a permit from another state that PA reciprocates to (i.e. Florida). There has been some debate over this. The strict letter of the law says "only if your home state has issued you a permit". But the PA Attorney General has issued a clarification saying that he considers ANY reciprocating state, even non-resident permit from FL, to qualify. I have also read that non-residents who have a non-resident permit from FL being able to get a PA LTCF. I think if we plan on staying in MD for longer then another year I will try this route.

    My wife and I have been shopping, visiting friends, and going to church in the Hanover PA region for 5 years. I have never seen a private citizen armed. I have a couple friends who are PA residents who have LTCF permits but never carry.

    Links here:

    PA State Police

    PA Uniform Firearms Act

    NRA Pamphlet

    PA Attorney General
     

    xd40c

    Business Owner-Gun Toter
    Sep 20, 2007
    2,067
    East Earl, PA
    For a non-resident, supposedly it is legal for you to carry concealed if you have a permit from another state that PA reciprocates to (i.e. Florida). There has been some debate over this. The strict letter of the law says "only if your home state has issued you a permit". But the PA Attorney General has issued a clarification saying that he considers ANY reciprocating state, even non-resident permit from FL, to qualify. I have also read that non-residents who have a non-resident permit from FL being able to get a PA LTCF. I think if we plan on staying in MD for longer then another year I will try this route.

    I agree with just about everything you say here. My understanding is you can only get a non res permit if you have a permit from the state where you reside. I guess we'll need to get clarification on this....
     

    gamer_jim

    Podcaster
    Feb 12, 2008
    13,233
    Hanover, PA
    I agree with just about everything you say here. My understanding is you can only get a non res permit if you have a permit from the state where you reside. I guess we'll need to get clarification on this....

    Check out the Attorney General's website.

    http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/crime.aspx?id=184

    It says:

    Note: It has come to the attention of the Office of Attorney General that there has been confusion over the applicability of Pennsylvania's reciprocal privileges with regard to the residency status of an individual who has been issued a valid license/permit. It is the position of the Office of Attorney General that recognition within Pennsylvania is based on the issuance to an individual of a valid license/permit by the reciprocal contracting state, and not on the license/permit holder's place of residence.

    Like I said, I have heard that non-residents to PA have successfully applied and received their PA LTCF permit. I've only heard people from York county getting it so it may be up to the individual sheriff's office to make that determination. PA gives the county sheriff a lot of say as to who can get LTCF or not. Right or wrong that seems to be what happens there in PA.
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,643
    PA
    My PA resident permit took 4 days to approve and cost 25 dollars for 5 years. You can carry practically everywhere, but schools, court houses, some airports and post offices. Carrying in Philly is a grey are as it is the only "city of the first class". They frown on OC, but a lot of people CC daily, myself included. Technically, you are only eligible for a non-res permit if you r state issues permits, and you have a resident permit. Of course they don't do much checking, and some people get them reguardless. The page from the AG posted previously applies to reciprocal permits. A MDer with a FL non-res permit has full reciprocity, and can carry in PA
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,643
    PA
    Do you have a MD permit?

    We're all in agreement regarding reciprocity....

    No MD permit, but I am a PA resident now. I spoke with a York county deputy in length about the LTCF process, and PA firearms laws. PA processes a huge ammount of permits, and does so very quickly, but they seem to err on the side of lieniency, in fact none of my references, or employer was contacted. Within a week, I established residency and got a driver's licence, applied for a LTCF on the same day(monday), got approved for the LTCF, and bought my first PA firearm on friday. I have had a FL permit for some time, and have routinely carried in PA&VA before, but now I hardly leave the house unarmed (unless I am heading to MD:mad54:). I am working on a MD non-res permit via the C&R "collector" angle, and will keep everyone posted as to the outcome.
     

    gamer_jim

    Podcaster
    Feb 12, 2008
    13,233
    Hanover, PA
    Mine goes anywhere but in the courthouse and church.

    I don't think there is a PA law preventing carrying in church, is there?

    I agree in principal but then again shootings at churches do happen.

    http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/14808321/detail.html

    If I could carry, I'm not sure I would carry to church but then again what if a gunman open fires on my congregation some Sunday morning? We used to have a member who was a federal agent and even that person said they did not carry to church.

    Oh, and you can take to the courthouse. They are supposed to have lockers where you can secure your firearm at the security checkpoint.

    I'm not trying to argue, just something to think about.
     

    Flash

    Active Member
    Jan 1, 2008
    154
    Adams County Pa.
    I don't think there is a PA law preventing carrying in church, is there?

    I agree in principal but then again shootings at churches do happen.

    http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/14808321/detail.html

    If I could carry, I'm not sure I would carry to church but then again what if a gunman open fires on my congregation some Sunday morning? We used to have a member who was a federal agent and even that person said they did not carry to church.

    Oh, and you can take to the courthouse. They are supposed to have lockers where you can secure your firearm at the security checkpoint.

    I'm not trying to argue, just something to think about.

    Yes, there were lockers in the old (York) court house but not so sure about the new one. I still don't have access to it so why carry it in court? I refuse to carry a weapon in church. Just my choice.
     

    fivepointstar

    Thank you MD-Goodbye
    Apr 28, 2008
    30,714
    3rd Rock from the Sun
    PA CCW

    I just want to say that I went to York PA today to renew my PA Permit that was going to expire after 5 yrs. For those going to York, the Sheriff's Office moved from County Courthouse to 45 N. George St, only a block away. I went to hte wrong building not realizing they moved. Also beware the road construction.

    I mailed in my application/check last month. I called and they said its ready. I gave my driver's license to hte clerk and he pulled my app. He entered my info in the computer and took my pix. I signed the permit adn copies and i was LITERALLY done in 3 minutes!!!!! Absolutely ZERO "red tape." $25 and no hassle!!

    :clap: KUDO's to York County SO and the Commonwealth of PA:clap:
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,080
    St Mary's County
    I just want to say that I went to York PA today to renew my PA Permit that was going to expire after 5 yrs. For those going to York, the Sheriff's Office moved from County Courthouse to 45 N. George St, only a block away. I went to hte wrong building not realizing they moved. Also beware the road construction.

    I mailed in my application/check last month. I called and they said its ready. I gave my driver's license to hte clerk and he pulled my app. He entered my info in the computer and took my pix. I signed the permit adn copies and i was LITERALLY done in 3 minutes!!!!! Absolutely ZERO "red tape." $25 and no hassle!!

    :clap: KUDO's to York County SO and the Commonwealth of PA:clap:

    Isn't that because you are a LEO? I tried to get a PA permit and they told me "no" since I don't have a permit in my home state. I guess it doesn't matter now that I have FL and VA permits which are good in PA.
     

    3rdRcn

    RIP
    Industry Partner
    Sep 9, 2007
    8,961
    Harford County
    Didn't they pass a federal law that LEO's do not need a carry permit in any state, by virtue of your badge and ID you get to carry anywhere?
     

    gamer_jim

    Podcaster
    Feb 12, 2008
    13,233
    Hanover, PA
    Isn't that because you are a LEO? I tried to get a PA permit and they told me "no" since I don't have a permit in my home state. I guess it doesn't matter now that I have FL and VA permits which are good in PA.

    You have to get the PA Attorney General involved then. See my previous post in this thread.
     

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