Best SHTF firearms solution for the elderly

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  • Blacksmith101

    Grumpy Old Man
    Jun 22, 2012
    22,156
    Agreed, my original thought was .357 revolver and lever action for versatility of shooting mild 38s and .357 if needed. After reading many posts I was leaning 22LR and now back to revolver and shotgun.

    Bottom line, This weekend they will shoot the many firearms recommended in this thread.

    Start them with the .22 RF and let them work their way up the recoil ladder at their own pace. When moving to a new caliber I always let them watch me shoot it first so they won't be surprised by the noise and can see the recoil so they will know what to expect.

    I hate seeing those videos where a guy hands his girlfriend a hand cannon and you know the rest....

    With older folks it may take more than one trip to the range to get them comfortable with shooting. Keep it fun don't over tire them. Explain they don't need to hit the bullseye all you want them to do is make them all go to the same place because the sights can be adjusted to make the group hit wherever you choose. Tell them the way to make them all go to the same place is to do the same thing each time same grip, same stance, same sight picture, same trigger pull, etc.

    If you have some fun targets or can print some out start with those and introduce bullseyes and human silhouettes later.

    https://www.targets.ws/game-targets.htm

    https://www.targets.ws/shooting-targets/scary-clown-target-2.pdf

    https://www.nssf.org/shooting/targets/

    https://www.luckygunner.com/free-targets

    Mother load list of printed target sites
    https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?343700-Targets-diy-splatter-amp-download-sites

    Thank you for introducing some new shooters and a special thank you for taking time for the seniors. Have fun!
     
    Last edited:

    pre64hunter

    Active Member
    Mar 19, 2010
    643
    Harford County
    The Police will take your gun

    They didn't have a gun all these years so more than likely they're not going out plinking and target practicing.
    Keep it simple and inexpensive, they probably will never use it or need to. Keep in mind that if you shoot someone or even at someone, the police will take your gun! The first thing they do if a cop shoots someone.
    I keep handy a reliable inexpensive single shot 22" 12ga. with big size steel shot, low recoil and limited penetration through walls. Shorter barrels have too much muzzle jump and a load of T at less than 10 feet is persuasive.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    FN ps-90 with an extended charging handle and a red dot sight.

    Fully ambi, low recoil, high capacity.
    I think 50 rounds of 5.7x28 should be plenty of firepower.

    That is my Dad's (95 in a couple of weeks) bedside firearm.

    He has handguns and shotguns, but just can't handle them well any longer.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    My father is in his 70s, he as dexterity issues. Anything that involves pushing a round into a mag is out. I have him setup with a over under 410/22lr and a H&R 20g depending on the threat. The hammers are getting hard for him to operate, I have been casually looking for a striker fired break barrel.


    The right gun for the job is the one you can operate.

    That is why I loaded all the mags my Dad has in the spring of 2020.

    So he didn't have to load them. Just shoot.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    Handgun skills are very perishable.

    You need to shoot a good bit to be good. More to be good under pressure. And then you need to continue to shoot.

    That is the advantage of the AR (5.56 or 9mm), PCC, Mini 14, PS-90.

    Also, arm and hand strength favor having a two hand firearm.

    But, as stated, getting them trained, then shooting at the range, starting with .22 and seeing what works is overall best. But I would definitely work in a PCC type firearm for comparison.

    I recall an Armed Citizen article a number of years ago. 3 young men broke in the house of an 86 year old man (IIRC) and his 83 year old wife. They smacked her around, and then concentrated on the man. The lady got up, went to the bedroom and returned with her pistol. A .44 Magnum. I think she killed one in the house, another made it outside before he died. The last was arrested when he went to the hospital for treatment :D
     

    smokey

    2A TEACHER
    Jan 31, 2008
    31,412
    Now the question about aiming-aids. Is something like a crimson trace laser grip or mini red dot optic beneficial, or since it's point-and shoot inside 15 feet, is it something not to worry about as much? There's no replacement for training, but people with some pretty bad skills have been able to make decent hits with a red dot optic and/or laser to help them out.
     

    SCARCQB

    Get Opp my rawn, Plick!
    Jun 25, 2008
    13,614
    Undisclosed location
    Most non -gun people suck at pistols or find rifles too heavy to handle well.

    A 9mm pistol AR or Ps-90 , when used by these folks with minimal training tend to do really well.

    If they can load, aim and fire the weapon. Get hits that count at typical home defense distances. That is the basics.

    Reloads , tactics , ninja moves , room clearing etc. isn’t really a realistic expectation. A barricaded defense , where they hunker down in a protected firing position is the best tactic.

    The goal is, to establish a means to shoot back quickly and deal with some physical limitations our elderly population deal with.

    I’ve experimented with a multitude of weapons for my parents and in-laws. The PS-90 comes out as the best option for elderly folks. ( in terms of ease of handling).

    A braced pcc like the cz- skorpion , Ruger carbines and the likes come second.

    Red dots are also a requirement. As most have less than perfect vision. Recoil , muzzle blast, concussion should also be taken into consideration.

    Reloads? 30 round or high capacity mags should be a workaround that issue.

    Overpenetration? That’s why the 5.7 with 49 grain v-max projectiles will limit that, coupled by pre planning firing zones and angles.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,818
    Now the question about aiming-aids. Is something like a crimson trace laser grip or mini red dot optic beneficial, or since it's point-and shoot inside 15 feet, is it something not to worry about as much? There's no replacement for training, but people with some pretty bad skills have been able to make decent hits with a red dot optic and/or laser to help them out.

    I would definitely recommend some sort of 'shake awake' type red dot for anything shoulder fired. Pistols, not so much.
     

    Uncle Duke

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 2, 2013
    11,667
    Not Far Enough from the City
    Handgun skills are very perishable.

    You need to shoot a good bit to be good. More to be good under pressure. And then you need to continue to shoot.

    That is the advantage of the AR (5.56 or 9mm), PCC, Mini 14, PS-90.

    Also, arm and hand strength favor having a two hand firearm.

    But, as stated, getting them trained, then shooting at the range, starting with .22 and seeing what works is overall best. But I would definitely work in a PCC type firearm for comparison.

    I recall an Armed Citizen article a number of years ago. 3 young men broke in the house of an 86 year old man (IIRC) and his 83 year old wife. They smacked her around, and then concentrated on the man. The lady got up, went to the bedroom and returned with her pistol. A .44 Magnum. I think she killed one in the house, another made it outside before he died. The last was arrested when he went to the hospital for treatment :D

    I remember that.

    Her name was Ma'am. And she was from wherever the f(ck she wants to be from. :)
     

    dblas

    Past President, MSI
    MDS Supporter
    Apr 6, 2011
    13,087
    For many years I disdained .410 for HD , but a cpl things have happened within the last decade or so :

    Those absolutely pointless , and near useless .45 Colt/ .410 Revolvers became very popular .

    So much so , multiple mfgs developed SD ammo just for them .

    While the .45/ .410 Revolvers are still pointless , when fired from a real Shotgun , the 00 and 000 have good possibilities , least way out as far as all 4 or 5 pellets stay on target,

    .22lr doesn't totally suck , From a Rifle . Yeah , yeah rimfire reliability . Sometimes wirh severe enough limitations , you have to roll with least worst option .

    Marlin 60 is lightweight , and easy for handling by virtually anyone who can stand upright w/o support . Load it for them in advance ( with " normal " 36-38gr HS HP ) . Within 17 rds , they will have either driven off average amateur home invaders , or already been killed by skilled professionals in force .

    They are pointless, but their rifle counterparts might be a best of both worlds. No chance of a misfeed like a pump, and if you have a failure, continue to pull the trigger for the next round.
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,734
    Socialist State of Maryland
    They are pointless, but their rifle counterparts might be a best of both worlds. No chance of a misfeed like a pump, and if you have a failure, continue to pull the trigger for the next round.

    I didn't know they made the Governor etc. in rifle size. That probably would be one of the best options as long as it fits the person who is going to use it.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    I use a Hi Point carbine to teach kids to shoot. Low recoil and reliable. 9mm ammo is relatively easy to get and, again relatively, cheap. Overall, reasonably priced and kept fed.

    Just a thought.

    A hi point carbine in 45 ACP, complimented with a laser would definitely do the job.

    If it was used in a HD scenario and gets confiscated, it's cheap and easy to acquire another.
     

    zoostation

    , ,
    Moderator
    Jan 28, 2007
    22,857
    Abingdon
    I would suggest a .38 caliber 4" revolver, reliable and easy to learn to shoot. I've seen new shooters totally turned off by a 9mm pistol as a first gun completely turn around when they get a .38 caliber revolver instead. I would avoid pump shotguns. Unless they are going to train constantly with one the action is just too unnatural, even police have ND's with pump shotguns. A simple mag-fed shotgun may be a better choice for a long gun imho.
     

    Goldslammer

    Active Member
    MDS Supporter
    Nov 10, 2010
    710
    Brooklyn Park
    img_0672%20(large).jpg_thumbnail0.jpg


    Rossi Coach Gun in 12 or 20ga, easy to cock hammers, short enough to handle in a hallway.
    Beware of Granny with a Shotgun!
     

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