Home Defense advice?

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  • Scan Monkey

    Member
    Dec 29, 2021
    15
    I'm a newbie here. A little over a year ago I purchased a Mossberg 590 Nightstick pump action 20 gauge for home defense from Big Dog Outfitters in VA. My son lives in Florida and worries about the old man and wanted me to have something for home defense. Well, I got little direction or help through the MD State police (It's classified in the Peoples Republic of Maryland as "other" because of the 14.5" barrel). Filled out their form which I was unable to complete because I needed a handgun license to complete the form!! Long story short I'm trying to get my money back ($947) but I'm not optimistic. I just bought a Turkish made Akkar Churchill 620 Tactical 20GA Pump-Action online. The gun store will take care of all the licensing and registering details when it's delivered there. Clearly I'm pretty dumb at these things, so advice more than welcome. Sorry for the long post, good to be here.
     

    AlBeight

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 30, 2017
    4,380
    Hampstead
    I'm a newbie here. A little over a year ago I purchased a Mossberg 590 Nightstick pump action 20 gauge for home defense from Big Dog Outfitters in VA. My son lives in Florida and worries about the old man and wanted me to have something for home defense. Well, I got little direction or help through the MD State police (It's classified in the Peoples Republic of Maryland as "other" because of the 14.5" barrel). Filled out their form which I was unable to complete because I needed a handgun license to complete the form!! Long story short I'm trying to get my money back ($947) but I'm not optimistic. I just bought a Turkish made Akkar Churchill 620 Tactical 20GA Pump-Action online. The gun store will take care of all the licensing and registering details when it's delivered there. Clearly I'm pretty dumb at these things, so advice more than welcome. Sorry for the long post, good to be here.
    No handgun HQL required for “other” that I’m aware of, and you don’t need the license to complete a form (they wouldn’t even hand you the form to begin if it were required). Also, no licensing or registration for a shotgun, just a 4473 transfer form. Don’t let that store tell you otherwise, better yet - find another shop to purchase from.
     

    camo556

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634
    I am not sure what the question is.

    I dont know what this is under maryland law:

    50651_590_Nightstick_WOOD-1.png



    what form? The only form I can think of which requires an HQL is the 77e, which only applies to handguns.

    Maryland and federal definitions are different. So if a "handgun" in MD is simply "a firearm with a barrel less than 16 inches in length. " https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2010/public-safety/title-5/subtitle-1/5-101

    then yes this is a handgun. But I am not sure.

    If you are trying to get your money back for the nightstick, you wont. Did you really pay $947 for this? That must have been the covid special price when shotguns were scarce. You can sell it, you wont get $950. Not even close.

    If the question is advice about home defense, the answer is yes you should.
     

    Scan Monkey

    Member
    Dec 29, 2021
    15
    I filled out the form online because of the pandemic. It reached a point where I had to fill in my gun license number in order to complete it. Called one number they gave me another, so i finally gave up. Again, I was flying blind with no help. The gun store in LaPlata will complete whatever paperwork I need (I added the words licensing and registering- I just made that assumption).
    Thanks for your response, I appreciate it.
     

    Scan Monkey

    Member
    Dec 29, 2021
    15
    Listed for $300 less at the time of purchase, and yes they probably saw the word "fool" tattooed on my forehead.
     

    camo556

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634

    rseymorejr

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 28, 2011
    26,015
    Harford County
    The Mossberg 590 Nightstick, 12 Ga, is on the Handgun Roster so Maryland considers it a handgun I guess? If so you'll need an HQL and possibly need to have the 20 Ga version added to the roster. Whoever is transfering this for you should be able to help you get all this sorted out.
    But Yikes! I'm thinking you should have gotten 2 of them for $947!
     

    camo556

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634
    The Mossberg 590 Nightstick, 12 Ga, is on the Handgun Roster so Maryland considers it a handgun I guess? If so you'll need an HQL and possibly need to have the 20 Ga version added to the roster. Whoever is transfering this for you should be able to help you get all this sorted out.
    But Yikes! I'm thinking you should have gotten 2 of them for $947!

    or 3 lol.

    ok well they are going for 700 on gunbroker so its not all that bad:

    https://www.gunbroker.com/All/searc...590 Nightstick&Timeframe=1&Sort=1&PageSize=48
     

    Scan Monkey

    Member
    Dec 29, 2021
    15
    Nightstick

    They told me at Big Dog Outfitters to go to the MD State website and fill out their 77R Form, then to All Pawn in southern MD to complete the 77R paperwork. This was over a year ago, so it's probably been restocked by now. Painful lesson learned.
     

    gwchem

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 18, 2014
    3,434
    SoMD
    Have you talked to Big Dogs? They're decent enough people. You may just get your money back and move on. Or, could you dispute the credit card charge?
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,643
    PA
    A pistol grip shotgun (or non NFA firearm) is probably the most difficult HD weapon to use. Low capacity, hard to reload, hard to aim, can have decent power with slugs or buckshot. Adding a brace can help substantially.
    Definitely spend some time at the range with it, look into a class if you can. Hopefully the transfer stuff or refund works out for you
     

    Scan Monkey

    Member
    Dec 29, 2021
    15
    The purchase was almost a year ago, (01/12/2021) Receipt says: "All firearms, ammunition, optics, and gunsmithing sales are final," but I never took possession so maybe a refund is possible. I'll check with them Monday. If not, I can go to All Pawn and maybe they can advise me on how to proceed if I went ahead and tried again with the 77R form. That is if it hasn't been restocked by now.
     

    gwchem

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 18, 2014
    3,434
    SoMD
    The purchase was almost a year ago, (01/12/2021) Receipt says: "All firearms, ammunition, optics, and gunsmithing sales are final," but I never took possession so maybe a refund is possible. I'll check with them Monday. If not, I can go to All Pawn and maybe they can advise me on how to proceed if I went ahead and tried again with the 77R form. That is if it hasn't been restocked by now.

    Good idea. It may be sitting in the back at All Pawn with them waiting for you to come over.
     

    camo556

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634
    The purchase was almost a year ago, (01/12/2021) Receipt says: "All firearms, ammunition, optics, and gunsmithing sales are final," but I never took possession so maybe a refund is possible. I'll check with them Monday. If not, I can go to All Pawn and maybe they can advise me on how to proceed if I went ahead and tried again with the 77R form. That is if it hasn't been restocked by now.

    To proceed with the 77R, first you need to get your handgun qualification license (HQL). Getting your HQL takes at least 30 days. See the link I posted above on getting your HQL. You need to look that process up. You could be HQL exempt, or you could be HQL training exempt, but in any case you need to do that 1st.


    Anyone who understands shotgun recoil would avoid it like the plague. See what you need to do/pay to get out of the deal.

    this too.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,884
    As noted , the 14 inch , non NFA shotgun like objects are considered a Handgun by Maryland . IF you thought you actually wanted a pistol grip only ( PGO) shotgun like object , an 18 inch bbl version does Not require an HQL , but does require 21 yo .

    As Alucard alludes , a PGO shotgun is cute and trendy , but probably not a good choice for the OP .

    At best they are very niche in application , and difficult to use effectively . At worst , a useless range toy .

    I won't currently rehash the whole Shotgun vs Pistol Caliber Carbine ( PCC) vs AR- 15 Debate . I will take at face value that a Shotgun has been rationally selected .

    In that context , the OP would be infinitely better served with an actual Shotgun , with real buttstock , and 18- 20 inch bbl . 20 ga is a viable option .
     
    I'm a newbie too, but it is my understanding that a firearm is still considered new until it is registered via the 77r process to the new owner. Since an HQL is required first to be qualified to purchase, the 77r application was probably never submitted to MD for processing. Thus, the firearm is still considered new and the store should be able to offer you a refund since they can technically sell as new.
     

    boothdoc

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 23, 2008
    5,133
    Frederick county
    It the company he purchased from shipped it and it was received by a local FFL and has been waiting for the owner to fix his ability to take possession it is still up to the original firm he bought it from if they will take it back or not. He will probably be hit with restocking and shipping coasts at the minimum and the local FFL might also have a small Managment fee for playing along.

    Good luck and get a firearm with a shoulder stock and a 16” Barrel
     

    [Kev308]

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 23, 2020
    3,800
    Maryland
    A lot of the videos I watch of people using the nightstick, looks like they are about to shoot their hand off with the recoil. If you eventually get this, get a hand strap on the foregrip or don't take it off if it comes with it.
     

    slsc98

    Ultimate Member
    May 24, 2012
    6,746
    Escaped MD-stan to WNC Smokies
    … Clearly I'm pretty dumb at these things, so advice more than welcome. Sorry for the long post, good to be here.

    Welcome; and, you’re not so much “dumb” as you are law-abiding in a corrupt DemonRat run cesspool known as MD where the motto is, “Pass laws to harass and tax the law abiding and which truly dumb voters are easily fooled into thinking have some effect on criminals.”

    Hope you are able to join your son in FL where they know how to treat the law abiding (and, unlike Md-Stan, they know how to treat criminals as well)
     

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