So confused/ AR pistol?

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  • HKB

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 14, 2007
    2,060
    Finksburg, MD
    So I have a stripped lower pre 2013 I want to build an AR pistol with. Looking at 10.5” complete uppers, what type of stock would make this legal in MD or is it not legal? Am I missing anything else?
    There is so much contradicting information out there I’m confused. Thanks
     

    bibitor

    Kulak
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 10, 2017
    1,894
    FEMA Region III
    No stock, need a pistol brace. Unless you are going the SBR route, then you will want to make sure you meet the 29" minimum length requirement.
     

    bibitor

    Kulak
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 10, 2017
    1,894
    FEMA Region III
    If I could find 16”(with flash) uppers I would prefer that but only stuff I can find instock is 10.5”.

    It's not a huge deal. If you "build" the lower as a pistol first then you can always convert to a rifle setup later.

    Someone will certainly correct me if I'm wrong, but on a pre-13 lower you do not need to meet the "heavey" requiment for the barrel. Not sure if that opens up any more options for you in your upper search.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,815
    It's not a huge deal. If you "build" the lower as a pistol first then you can always convert to a rifle setup later.

    Someone will certainly correct me if I'm wrong, but on a pre-13 lower you do not need to meet the "heavey" requiment for the barrel. Not sure if that opens up any more options for you in your upper search.
    Pretty much agreed except...
    Building a pistol on a pre ban lower isn't a waste. You can always convert it to a rifle afterwards. If you bought the lower before the ban, you don't need a heavy barrel if building a rifle.
    The world is your oyster. Build away.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    If you plan on it being a pistol for all time, then it is a waste to use a pre-2013 lower. Just buy another lower and build your pistol.

    If you are planning on making it an SMR, it would be a waste to use a pre-2103 lower. Just buy another lower, and build your SBR.

    The pre-2013 lower may be built into a pencil barrel rifle. And that is the goodness in them.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,815
    If you plan on it being a pistol for all time, then it is a waste to use a pre-2013 lower. Just buy another lower and build your pistol.

    If you are planning on making it an SMR, it would be a waste to use a pre-2103 lower. Just buy another lower, and build your SBR.

    The pre-2013 lower may be built into a pencil barrel rifle. And that is the goodness in them.
    You act as though going from pistol to rifle is a giant PIA. No. You slip on (or off) a brace or buttstock and switch uppers. Done in 15 seconds.


    I never got the romance with pencil barrels. You get them heated up and they whip around like licorice. Back when Colt came out with their Hbar, everyone was dumping their 'skinny' ARs for Colt Hbar Sporters.
     

    sbowers

    Active Member
    Jun 15, 2012
    225
    You act as though going from pistol to rifle is a giant PIA. No. You slip on (or off) a brace or buttstock and switch uppers. Done in 15 seconds.


    I never got the romance with pencil barrels. You get them heated up and they whip around like licorice. Back when Colt came out with their Hbar, everyone was dumping their 'skinny' ARs for Colt Hbar Sporters.

    I agree. The only advantage of a pencil barrel on a pre-13 lower would be variety and availability of uppers. However, in this climate, all uppers are scarce.
     

    temccoy

    Active Member
    Nov 13, 2020
    102
    10.5” is a good compromise length for an AR pistol. You don’t lose too much velocity to the shorter length - about 200-250 FPS, and it is definitely lighter and easier to use. It uses the same gas length as the CAR action, so it functions reliably. I believe the ATF rules - until they change them again - are that the brace for a pistol cannot exceed a 13.5” length of pull. I have braces from SB Tactical, and they meet the required LOP. Have fun with it, they are a hoot to shoot.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,879
    No , everyone did Not dump their " pencil"bbls for Colt Sporter Target HBAR's , and I was around then . Not a slam upon " big pin" Sporters per se . The marketing concept behind them was crap , but the rifles themselves were well made and accurate .

    Back in the day , there WAS a rapid transition from A1 profile to A2 profile . And in the then dominate 20 inch platform , without kitchen sink hanging off the rifles b the A2 was / is indeed a worthwhile data point splitting balance for offhand shooting , and moderate overall weight .

    But that was then , and trends have changed .

    The biggest one , is that 30yrs ago , the default configuration was 20 inch bbls , and 16in was the outlier . Nowdays , 16 inch is the overwhelming norm , and a fixed buttstock 20 inch bbl rifle is a curiosity .

    If you squint a little bit , a 16 inch HBAR , and a 20 inch A2 are in the same neighborhood of overall weight and offhand balance .
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,815
    No , everyone did Not dump their " pencil"bbls for Colt Sporter Target HBAR's , and I was around then . Not a slam upon " big pin" Sporters per se . The marketing concept behind them was crap , but the rifles themselves were well made and accurate .
    By "everybody", you know I didn't mean evreybody...:rolleyes:

    (and yes, I was in the thick of it then as well)
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    You act as though going from pistol to rifle is a giant PIA. No. You slip on (or off) a brace or buttstock and switch uppers. Done in 15 seconds.


    I never got the romance with pencil barrels. You get them heated up and they whip around like licorice. Back when Colt came out with their Hbar, everyone was dumping their 'skinny' ARs for Colt Hbar Sporters.

    It is not. But if you build a rifle from the lower and that make it a pistol, you have broken the law.

    There are a LOT of barrels between the original GI pencil barrel and an HBAR to chose from.

    And some people might want an A1 profile or similar to fill out a collection. If I could buy one of the Colt A1s they are making, I would.
     

    Kicken Wing

    Snakes and Sparklers
    Apr 5, 2014
    868
    WASH-CO
    Just my 2 cents. I have built all of my stripped lowers pre-2013 into pistols. If I ever want to swap out the brace for a stock and put a pencil barrel or an hbar upper on them.... No problem.

    I have some 10.5" uppers. They are fun to shoot. I was planning on doing a 10.5" upper on my first pistol build. The overwhelming amount of info that I absorbed before getting an upper suggested that using anything shorter than 10.5" could be problematic, wrong, useless, etc. I went against the grain and bought a 7.5" upper in .223 wylde and it is hands down my favorite AR pistol. I have a holosun green dot on it and I have no problem hitting 6" steel plates at 100 yards without trying. One day when I was at peacemaker I decided to try it out on one of the 200 yard lanes. I had no problem nailing the larger steel plates at that distance. I was actually shocked that my mediocre eyes/skills along with this pistol that "should not be" equipped with a single magnification reflex sight pulled off 200 yards consistently.

    Don't over think it. If a 10.5" is what you can score and you are just out to shoot for sh!ts and giggles like I am then go for it. You can always change it up at a later date. AR pistols are fun to shoot... Enjoy!
     
    Last edited:

    Kicken Wing

    Snakes and Sparklers
    Apr 5, 2014
    868
    WASH-CO
    One biggie that seems to have NOT been mentioned here is the fact that if you are building this on a registered receiver, the transfer should have been filled out as "other" on your paperwork from your FFL, not as "rifle".

    Also, the hbar rule only applies to rifles. If you are building a pistol you can use whatever barrel you prefer.
     

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