Concealed Carry Without A Permit

Sid Hatfield · Dec 4, 2020

Blaster229 said:
Asking someone if they have guns or drugs and trying to get a consent search has NOTHING to do with situational awareness levels. Seeing how many people occupy a car isn't "sizing a person up".
I can't wait for the day a cop like you pulls me over and wants to try and get a consent search.
You'll get an education for sure.

Well first off, I rarely ask for consent to search cars. I've been doing this long enough that I can usually tell who needs to come out of a car and I can usually develop legitimate PC for a search without having to ask for it. I'm also pretty sure that you've never done this job or if you have, it was in a pretty low-speed area and you weren't very good at it. But you can fantasize about getting past me with a gun that you're not supposed to have all you like. You wouldn't be the first one to do it and honestly if that's all you're doing you're really not worth my time.

Have a nice day.

Blaster229 · Dec 4, 2020

Sid Hatfield said:
Well first off, I rarely ask for consent to search cars. I've been doing this long enough that I can usually tell who needs to come out of a car and I can usually develop legitimate PC for a search without having to ask for it. I'm also pretty sure that you've never done this job or if you have, it was in a pretty low-speed area and you weren't very good at it. But you can fantasize about getting past me with a gun that you're not supposed to have all you like. You wouldn't be the first one to do it and honestly if that's all you're doing you're really not worth my time.

Have a nice day.

I was doing highway drug interdiction in the 90's when you were still in elementary school.

travistheone · Dec 4, 2020

hormones are raging in here!

Sid Hatfield · Dec 4, 2020

Blaster229 said:
I was doing highway drug interdiction in the 90's when you were still in elementary school.

Why so angry? Makes me doubt your claim. You might want to switch to decaf.

Johnny5k · Dec 4, 2020

Really enjoying the convo here. Not the animosity, though. Its hard for me to discuss this stuff. Im a clean cut, clean record, give the shirt off my back type white boy and I always have to remind myself that most people either never had any interactions with LEO or have had relatively pleasant ones under the circumstances. I've known some really good LEOs. Just wish they would police their own.

My experiences are different. Who needs PC when extortion and threats of violence work pretty well. They have with me. I have had every single receipt and paper/ membership card individually examined during a search. Ive had my dashboard cut open. I've been accused of being a "gang-banger". Ive had my sexuality questioned. I've been threatened with everything from going to jail to being shot on sight. I've had girls, (usually my GF) in my car shamelessly hit on during a stop. I could tell stories for HOURS, and it still would be less time than I have spent on the side of the road without so much as a warning. I've been detained and searched in my own driveway on multiple occasions. Ive seen an off duty officer pull out a badge and a bag of white powder and threaten to send a friend to jail for 20 years for something they overheard them saying to another friend about a football game in a bar. I've had them refuse to respond to attempted murder in progress and burglary in progress. Ive been threatened with arrest for attempting to report an assault and battery. I knew a guy robbed at gunpoint by uniformed officer in a squad car, only to report it, get robbed again the next day, and told where his body would end up if reported again. I could go on and on.

And they wonder why I get a little nervous when Im pulled over....

Occam · Dec 4, 2020

Sid Hatfield said:
Makes me doubt your claim.

Uh oh.

winch · Dec 4, 2020

I ponder this question on a regular basis: "Do I want to illegally carry for self defense, with the possibility, no matter how slight, that I could go to prison because of it?"
My #1 objective in life is not to be imprisoned, so thus far, I have not broken the law. However, I no longer take risks like going into the city unless absolutely necessary. But you just never know when you will be put in the middle of a bad situation. It can happen in broad daylight on a Sunday afternoon on a main street. Bad things happen quickly.

Biggfoot44 · Dec 4, 2020

Damn ! This one is about to go rapidly sideways in three directions simultaneously .

Johnny5k · Dec 4, 2020

Biggfoot44 said:
Damn ! This one is about to go rapidly sideways in three directions simultaneously .

Some days, every direction is sideways.

lkenefic · Dec 5, 2020

Well, before this thread takes a major dump... I lived in AZ for years before moving here. I went through the original CCW stuff before they became a constitutional carry state. That's said, it seems strange to me that an AZ LEO would just arbitrarily search a car like this... maybe times have changed...

SharpShoooter · Dec 6, 2020

Sid Hatfield said:
I can usually develop legitimate PC for a search without having to ask for it.

But you can fantasize about getting past me with a gun that you're not supposed to have all you like.

.

Develop? Either you have probable cause to search or you don't. Develop sounds like you're putting together or creating. Again, either there's a solid reason to search or there isn't.

If somebody has a gun that they not supposed to have and you don't see it, there's no way you'll see it if you don't have probably cause(or for some silly reason they give consent). You can't create probabale cause that doesn't exist, that's just simply violating rights.

My advice to people here, don't answer questions on a stop. They are only trying to find things to charge you with,they are not pulling you over to help you. Never ever consent to a search,even though most cops think you're hiding something if you don't,which is silly. Privacy is a thing.

Lastly, ALWAYS film the police

brownspotz · Dec 7, 2020

Sid Hatfield said:
Well first off, I rarely ask for consent to search cars. I've been doing this long enough that I can usually tell who needs to come out of a car and I can usually develop legitimate PC for a search without having to ask for it. I'm also pretty sure that you've never done this job or if you have, it was in a pretty low-speed area and you weren't very good at it. But you can fantasize about getting past me with a gun that you're not supposed to have all you like. You wouldn't be the first one to do it and honestly if that's all you're doing you're really not worth my time.

Have a nice day.

troll harder elsewhere, cupcake.

brownspotz · Dec 7, 2020

Johnny5k said:
Really enjoying the convo here. Not the animosity, though. Its hard for me to discuss this stuff. Im a clean cut, clean record, give the shirt off my back type white boy and I always have to remind myself that most people either never had any interactions with LEO or have had relatively pleasant ones under the circumstances. I've known some really good LEOs. Just wish they would police their own.

My experiences are different. Who needs PC when extortion and threats of violence work pretty well. They have with me. I have had every single receipt and paper/ membership card individually examined during a search. Ive had my dashboard cut open. I've been accused of being a "gang-banger". Ive had my sexuality questioned. I've been threatened with everything from going to jail to being shot on sight. I've had girls, (usually my GF) in my car shamelessly hit on during a stop. I could tell stories for HOURS, and it still would be less time than I have spent on the side of the road without so much as a warning. I've been detained and searched in my own driveway on multiple occasions. Ive seen an off duty officer pull out a badge and a bag of white powder and threaten to send a friend to jail for 20 years for something they overheard them saying to another friend about a football game in a bar. I've had them refuse to respond to attempted murder in progress and burglary in progress. Ive been threatened with arrest for attempting to report an assault and battery. I knew a guy robbed at gunpoint by uniformed officer in a squad car, only to report it, get robbed again the next day, and told where his body would end up if reported again. I could go on and on.

And they wonder why I get a little nervous when Im pulled over....

you need to learn the words my father told me. "don't give them a reason to pull you over."

Kman · Dec 7, 2020

SharpShoooter said:
Develop? Either you have probable cause to search or you don't. Develop sounds like you're putting together or creating. Again, either there's a solid reason to search or there isn't.

If somebody has a gun that they not supposed to have and you don't see it, there's no way you'll see it if you don't have probably cause(or for some silly reason they give consent). You can't create probabale cause that doesn't exist, that's just simply violating rights.

My advice to people here, don't answer questions on a stop. They are only trying to find things to charge you with,they are not pulling you over to help you. Never ever consent to a search,even though most cops think you're hiding something if you don't,which is silly. Privacy is a thing.

Lastly, ALWAYS film the police

You know, "develop" as in manufacture, create, fabricate.

Telling and scary.

rbird7282 · Dec 7, 2020

Sid Hatfield said:
I don't make up probable cause for a search. Little thing called integrity. I've let plenty of cars roll away that I was pretty sure were dirty because I didn't have grounds for a search. It works like that sometimes. Constitution and all. And if you have a weapon in the car and a good reason--like to/from the range and stored reasonably legally-- I don't have a problem with that as long as you're not doing criminal stuff with it. Again, that's just me though.

If I have a weapon in the car and a good reason, it’s none of your business. You also wouldn’t know because I wouldn’t tell you.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Johnny5k · Dec 7, 2020

brownspotz said:
you need to learn the words my father told me. "don't give them a reason to pull you over."

Haha, they give themselves the reason, I don't give it. I once got pulled over 3 times by 3 different cops within 30 minutes and 10 miles. Not so much as a warning, only one gave a reason, said I touched the double gold.

My very first time being pulled over, I was on the side of the road for almost 3 hours. I left with a warning for not having my headlights on. When I was pulled over, it was light outside, and I was in a car with automatic headlights and daytime running lights.

I got pulled over crossing the bay bridge once. It was a really odd interaction, both before and during the stop. He got along side of me then behind me 3 or 4 times before lighting the lights. A brief paraphrasing of the ensuing convo:

Did you buy this truck that way.
Fresh from the dealerships says I.
Where is your front bumper reflectors?
It is as I bought it. Do I need some bumper reflectors?
I don't know was the reply.
Well then why are we here?
Well, some people with custom vehicles just put a thin little strip of reflector on there.
Is that all I need, some thin reflective strips?
I dont know.
Well, why have you pulled me over if you do not know?
Well, see, there are two books, the one we go by and the one the DMV goes by.
Which book says I need reflectors.
I dont know.
Again, why are we here.

Left that with a repair order warning. Never heard of such a thing before and never heard of it again. Never got any reflectors.

My favorite excuse was, once again, with a truck fresh from the dealership, this time, a brand new truck, not used and custom, not even 3 months old.

"I pulled you over because your tag light is a little dim"

welder516 · Dec 7, 2020

Sid-Fred & Roid is full of himself .

HankR · Dec 7, 2020

I don't think this would even be a crime in Arizona (or any western state, "western" != "west coast")

[Kev308] · Dec 7, 2020

Johnny5k said:
Haha, they give themselves the reason, I don't give it. I once got pulled over 3 times by 3 different cops within 30 minutes and 10 miles. Not so much as a warning, only one gave a reason, said I touched the double gold.

My very first time being pulled over, I was on the side of the road for almost 3 hours. I left with a warning for not having my headlights on. When I was pulled over, it was light outside, and I was in a car with automatic headlights and daytime running lights.

I got pulled over crossing the bay bridge once. It was a really odd interaction, both before and during the stop. He got along side of me then behind me 3 or 4 times before lighting the lights. A brief paraphrasing of the ensuing convo:

Did you buy this truck that way.
Fresh from the dealerships says I.
Where is your front bumper reflectors?
It is as I bought it. Do I need some bumper reflectors?
I don't know was the reply.
Well then why are we here?
Well, some people with custom vehicles just put a thin little strip of reflector on there.
Is that all I need, some thin reflective strips?
I dont know.
Well, why have you pulled me over if you do not know?
Well, see, there are two books, the one we go by and the one the DMV goes by.
Which book says I need reflectors.
I dont know.
Again, why are we here.

Left that with a repair order warning. Never heard of such a thing before and never heard of it again. Never got any reflectors.

My favorite excuse was, once again, with a truck fresh from the dealership, this time, a brand new truck, not used and custom, not even 3 months old.

"I pulled you over because your tag light is a little dim"

I would get pulled over at least 3x a month when I was a teenager because I drove an awesome '85 Lincoln Towncar. Loved that car. One night I got 3 cops, all interviewing me thru 3 different windows and one says,
"why do have a bent soda can under your seat?"
"Because I'm a slob."
"Step out of the car sir...."

Dovk0802 · Dec 7, 2020

brownspotz said:
you need to learn the words my father told me. "don't give them a reason to pull you over."

When I thought I was going to leave active duty I started doing ride a longs and usually make a practice of doing so, when I move to a new area. When I did leave active duty I joined a VFD as an EMT & hung out with a lot of cops. I have repeatedly heard the similar statement that an officer can find a reason to stop any driver; the vehicle code is simply too complex and driving is too hard, let alone those open to interpretation. And then there was the time I was pulled over for "driving in a high crime area."

This is not a comment of bad/good cops or what to say or do; & advocate to lay low (... and be safe ; ), just being fair as to what the situation actually is.

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