Compressed Powder Charge 45-70

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  • pre64hunter

    Active Member
    Mar 19, 2010
    643
    Harford County
    I'm loading a Hornady FTX 325 grain using 60 grains H335 in a Marlin 1895 lever gun. With the long point on the FTX you have to trim the cases about .050 shorter in order to crimp at the cannelure and meet the correct overall length to function in a lever action.(that's the way Hornady factory ammo is).

    The powder is about 3/16" from the case mouth and gets compressed.
    My question is when I seat the bullet, it gets hard to finish seating as if there's too much powder. I have many compressed powder loads I've used over the years and never had this issue, the powder compresses and fits.
    It seems to me and feels like the cartridge gets an air lock, like the bullet will pop back out, like its full of compressed air, near the end of the stroke it feels spongy.

    I reduced the load to 58.5 and it's still amazingly accurate but still compressed. Loading the 45-70, the difference in velocity with a couple grains of powder is very slight. Still the same seating issue but maybe not as much.
    I'm using an RCBS Rockchucker press with plenty of leverage and Redding dies with a separate crimp die.
    Any ideas about this with the 45-70?
     

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    GunBum

    Active Member
    Feb 21, 2018
    751
    SW Missouri
    If you want the powder charge to settle better and be easier to compress, then try dropping the powder charge through a long tube. This is the common solution for heavy black powder loads in .45-70 and works just as well with heavy smokeless loads. I have a 3/8” ish diameter brass tube about 18” long that I use. I use my Redding powder measure to drop the charge, and then pour the powder through a funnel to the tube to the case. If that makes any sense. I can’t take a picture because all my loading stuff is packed up in the middle of a move. Anyway, you can get 5-10% more powder by dropping through a long tube.
     

    Trigger Time

    Amazed
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 23, 2013
    1,231
    If you're getting groups like that , you probably shouldn't change anything.
    There is nothing wrong with a compressed load as long as you are within the pressure limits of the gun, they will usually be the most accurate and consistent.

    I get similar results with a compressed load of 4064 driving the 300grain Hodnady bullet.
     

    pre64hunter

    Active Member
    Mar 19, 2010
    643
    Harford County
    If you want the powder charge to settle better and be easier to compress, then try dropping the powder charge through a long tube. This is the common solution for heavy black powder loads in .45-70 and works just as well with heavy smokeless loads. I have a 3/8” ish diameter brass tube about 18” long that I use. I use my Redding powder measure to drop the charge, and then pour the powder through a funnel to the tube to the case. If that makes any sense. I can’t take a picture because all my loading stuff is packed up in the middle of a move. Anyway, you can get 5-10% more powder by dropping through a long tube.

    Yes, I do that and tap the case, pack it best I can. It just feels like I'm compressing air, almost seems like it would push the primer out, even so the big case should handle a little compression.
    I agree not to change anything but just curious if anyone else notices this.
     

    byf43

    SCSC Life/NRA Patron Life
    Outstanding accuracy!!!!!!!!!

    I've not loaded any shortened .45-70 cases (Hornady FTX type), but, from Hodgdon's site, that 60 grains is max with the 350 grain bullet in a 'standard length' case.

    "I" would be concerned with signs of pressures.

    Again, that accuracy is OUTSTANDING!!!!!!!
     

    Trigger Time

    Amazed
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 23, 2013
    1,231
    Outstanding accuracy!!!!!!!!!

    I've not loaded any shortened .45-70 cases (Hornady FTX type), but, from Hodgdon's site, that 60 grains is max with the 350 grain bullet in a 'standard length' case.

    "I" would be concerned with signs of pressures.

    Again, that accuracy is OUTSTANDING!!!!!!!

    The FTX is only 325 grains so you really can't compare that to a 350 bullet, or apples to oranges.
     

    Trigger Time

    Amazed
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 23, 2013
    1,231
    Anything you say.........

    It's not what I say, it's what the published data says. I'm not aware of any data that shows the same pressure for any two bullets of a different style and weight.
    However one thing that all reloading manuals seem to agree on is that a heavier bullet will create more pressure than a lighter bullet with the same charge. If there is some published data to contradict that statement, I would be very interested to see it.
     

    byf43

    SCSC Life/NRA Patron Life
    It's not what I say, it's what the published data says. I'm not aware of any data that shows the same pressure for any two bullets of a different style and weight.
    However one thing that all reloading manuals seem to agree on is that a heavier bullet will create more pressure than a lighter bullet with the same charge. If there is some published data to contradict that statement, I would be very interested to see it.


    My whole point was...... I'm not arguing with you, or your point.

    Have a nice night.
     

    pre64hunter

    Active Member
    Mar 19, 2010
    643
    Harford County
    Outstanding accuracy!!!!!!!!!

    I've not loaded any shortened .45-70 cases (Hornady FTX type), but, from Hodgdon's site, that 60 grains is max with the 350 grain bullet in a 'standard length' case.

    "I" would be concerned with signs of pressures.

    Again, that accuracy is OUTSTANDING!!!!!!!

    No signs of pressure at all.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,881
    Ok , checked Hogdon 2014 data for 325 FTX and H335 .

    Under Trapdoor :

    Start 57.0 @ 17,500
    Max 63.5 @ 27,400

    So yes , zero issues with 60.0 gr in a Marlin , actually pretty mild .
     

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