Irons = Fail!

slyitry · Sep 21, 2021

Decided to forgo the red dots and shoot irons. I don't know if it's just because I haven't in a while but shooting irons with a helmet and electronic ears is far more difficult than I thought. I was also using the large aperture at 18 yards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbG6aqdjw6Q

outrider58 · Sep 21, 2021

Maybe slow down some?

noahhh · Sep 21, 2021

It's the poor workman who blames his tools....

slyitry · Sep 21, 2021

I'm an Eotech guy. I can be so much faster and more accurate with it. But you guys are correct it's not the tool it's me. with slowing my shots and practice I may be able to improve my groups to quarter size and not paper plate size.

Threeband · Sep 21, 2021

Not sure what the helmet is for.

Why not sign up for an Appleseed? Get some fundamentals before blowing a lot of ammo on those drills.

GuitarmanNick · Sep 21, 2021

The large aperture is not intended to be used for accuracy. It is used for targets at short distance for faster acquisition. Looks like you killed 'em all.

gwchem · Sep 21, 2021

At 18 yards, you could point shoot a rifle much more accurately than that.

If this was a post looking for advice, I'd recommend some in-person fundamental technique lessons.

John from MD · Sep 21, 2021

Are you jerking the trigger? Have you bench sighted the rifle first?

3paul10 · Sep 21, 2021

Fundamentals....and I still be at a small aperature greater than 15 yards.....just me...

outrider58 · Sep 21, 2021

slyitry said:
I'm an Eotech guy. I can be so much faster and more accurate with it. But you guys are correct it's not the tool it's me. with slowing my shots and practice I may be able to improve my groups to quarter size and not paper plate size.

Shoot accurately first. The speed will come.

River02 · Sep 21, 2021

Without immediate POI care and surgical skittles they're all pretty much gonna meet their maker---mission accomplished.

slyitry · Sep 21, 2021

I benched the rifle probably a year and a half ago. I don't think I'm jerking the trigger it just my sight picture is not great. And the helmet.............well I spend an incredible amount of time watching Lucas Botkin from Trex Arms.

John from MD · Sep 21, 2021

As the clown said, go slow and then increase speed as you get proficient.

omegared24 · Sep 21, 2021

outrider58 said:
Shoot accurately first. The speed will come.

This man knows his stuff.

I really like iron sights and prefer them over red dots.

SkiPatrolDude · Sep 21, 2021

slyitry said:
I benched the rifle probably a year and a half ago. I don't think I'm jerking the trigger it just my sight picture is not great. And the helmet.............well I spend an incredible amount of time watching Lucas Botkin from Trex Arms.

Lol I respect the honesty.

But I’d rather have a chest rig and no helmet than a helmet with no chest rig.

camo556 · Sep 21, 2021

Any time you change your loadout (from holo/rds/scope to irons or back) you will be slower until you practice. Shooting with holo/rds is fundamentally different than irons. Irons, you focus on the front sight. rds, you focus on the target. It takes time/practice/drills to adjust. You cannot just jump from irons to carry optics on a pistol for example and expect to be faster (or the reverse). You need to do drills to burn in the muscle memory with either platform. Of course when you go back you also may need to re-adjust.

If you are faster and more accurate with an Eotech, I say just send it with the Eotech. Depends on your use case for irons sights. The reason to use irons imo is that batteries or the optic could crap out. Mine has crapped out in the middle of a stage. I used my backup irons and still finished. If the optic craps in the middle of SHTF, you need a backup sighting system. But really, its plan B or C.

spoon059 · Sep 21, 2021

#1 all those hits will get the job done
#2 snuggling in behind the irons with big ear muffs on is quite difficult, so its quite possible you weren't getting a consistent sight picture

Irons are quite accurate, and I enjoy the opportunity to use them when I can. My issued rifle has a red dot, which is what I would use in the field, so I tend to practice with the red dot and get used to that sight picture. But I've been out to 525 yards with irons (prone) and was pretty happy to bang steel more often than not!

outrider58 · Sep 21, 2021

A good way to apply irons is through co-witnessing a red dot. That's, more than likely, gonna be your 'realworld' need for relying on irons. Learn to shoot your irons through your turned off red dot. And, oh yeah, it's gonna be harder.

TheBert · Sep 21, 2021

slyitry said:
Decided to forgo the red dots and shoot irons. I don't know if it's just because I haven't in a while but shooting irons with a helmet and electronic ears is far more difficult than I thought. I was also using the large aperture at 18 yards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbG6aqdjw6Q

AR-15? Shooting during daylight you need to use the small aperture. You should be shooting at 25 yards for a 200 yard zero.

Biggfoot44 · Sep 22, 2021

I rarely click links w/o embeded preview ,but from the discussion , this is with a RIFLE ?!? @ 18yd ?

That's not a sites issue , that's a fundamentals issue . @ 18yds with totally slick top rifle with no sights at all , fired from the shoulder , groups should be waay tighter than that .

Yeah , those hits would be fatal , but if your going to carry a rifle , there should be higher expectations than for a pocket size subcompact pistol .

I don't want to be discouraging to the OP . Some Appleseed/ NRA Basic Rifle/ BSA Rifle Shooting Merit Badge/ Hunter Safety/ coaching from moderately experienced mentor/ etc , and you'll soon be shooting much better .

****************

Perhaps Bert was thinking of the 50/ 200 rule of thumb with iron sights ?

Irons = Fail!

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