AR pistol questions

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  • Nickberg500

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 20, 2019
    1,064
    North of Baltimore County
    I'm in the process of buying stripped lowers to insure I'll have builds to work on regardless of what happens in Annapolis; I have a few questions:

    - Since guns built into pistols can then alternate between being a pistol and rifle, if I had an AR-9 lower and an AR-15 lower, could I build out my AR-9 pistol, then throw a magwell conversion on the AR-15 lower, swap it out temporarily with the AR-9 lower, and then say "it started out as a pistol"? Then proceed to build it out as a rifle, and later on convert it back to pistol? Is a mag conversion even necessary? What arbitrary line can I cross to say "this AR-15 was a pistol in the past".

    - Once a stripped AR-9 lower is bought, since it's cash and carry, there's no registration right? So if I buy one in a private sale, then build it into a pistol, I do not have to fill out a 77r or inform the MSP, correct?

    - Are there any pitfalls in building the AR-9, regarding both legality and interchangeability? I know there's something about the buffer needing some sort of spacer if you're using AR-15 parts.
     

    Bountied

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 6, 2012
    6,906
    Pasadena
    All stripped lowers need a 77r since it is not a long gun yet, even stripped AR-9 lowers because they can be made into pistols.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,818
    Dedicated pistol caliber lowers still require paperwork. There is no waiting period.

    Much ado is made of building an AR15 lower into a pistol first(I'm as guilty as anyone). I think of it this way, one of the first thinks that goes onto a stripped lower is a buffer tube. Once a buffer tube is mounted on a lower, that lower in essence, is now a pistol build.
    IANAL
     

    Nickberg500

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 20, 2019
    1,064
    North of Baltimore County
    All stripped lowers need a 77r since it is not a long gun yet, even stripped AR-9 lowers because they can be made into pistols.

    Dedicated pistol caliber lowers still require paperwork. There is no waiting period.

    Much ado is made of building an AR15 lower into a pistol first(I'm as guilty as anyone). I think of it this way, one of the first thinks that goes onto a stripped lower is a buffer tube. Once a buffer tube is mounted on a lower, that lower in essence, is now a pistol build.
    IANAL

    Are you 100% sure a private sale of a stripped AR-9 lower has to go through an FFL or the MSP? My understanding is that they're cash and carry, and the HQL is for handguns, of which a stripped lower is not. Can anyone point me to what law says this? Not trying to be a royal PITA, just need to make sure.
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 22, 2009
    59,775
    Bel Air
    Dedicated pistol caliber lowers still require paperwork. There is no waiting period.

    Much ado is made of building an AR15 lower into a pistol first(I'm as guilty as anyone). I think of it this way, one of the first thinks that goes onto a stripped lower is a buffer tube. Once a buffer tube is mounted on a lower, that lower in essence, is now a pistol build.
    IANAL

    The ATF has a special detector and knows the exact moment the rifle buffer tube goes on the lower......
     

    spoon059

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 1, 2018
    5,340
    I bought mine as pistols. Had to wait 7 days for the background check nonsense. If they run my serial number, it was purchased as a pistol. That's my proof.

    Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk
     

    Bountied

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 6, 2012
    6,906
    Pasadena
    The last time I bought a stripped lower it was a 7 day wait. It was going to become a 9mm pistol build. All the lowers I've bought since October 2013 have had to go through the MSP portal and required a 7 day wait. You can do a FTF cash and carry if you want but I'm not sure what would happen if the cops showed up. Call a LGS and ask them.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,818
    I bought mine as pistols. Had to wait 7 days for the background check nonsense. If they run my serial number, it was purchased as a pistol. That's my proof.

    Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

    The last time I bought a stripped lower it was a 7 day wait. It was going to become a 9mm pistol build. All the lowers I've bought since October 2013 have had to go through the MSP portal and required a 7 day wait. You can do a FTF cash and carry if you want but I'm not sure what would happen if the cops showed up. Call a LGS and ask them.
    If these were standard(for AR15) lowers, then yes, 7 day wait. If they were dedicated pistol caliber lowers, you should not have been made to wait.
    *unless there has been a change in the law I'm not aware of*


    Dedicated pistol caliber lowers still require paperwork. There is no waiting period
    .
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,818
    The ATF has a special detector and knows the exact moment the rifle buffer tube goes on the lower......
    I used to take pictures of them with pistol uppers on them, but I got tired of people saying timestamps can be faked. Fact of the matter is, they have to prove it was a rifle first, no matter what...and then that guy is going to come on here say how they don't want to be the "test case" for that. I tell them not to build pistols then.
     

    grimnar15

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 21, 2019
    1,645
    I don’t understand any of this. I buy lowers, fill out 77r, wait a week and they’re transferred to me as other (neither pistol or rifle). I build what ever I want and then if I want to sell the lower I go through and FFL to transfer to the new owner.
     

    Bountied

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 6, 2012
    6,906
    Pasadena
    If these were standard(for AR15) lowers, then yes, 7 day wait. If they were dedicated pistol caliber lowers, you should not have been made to wait.
    *unless there has been a change in the law I'm not aware of*


    .

    They were all standard lowers so that makes sense.

    Isn't it odd that a 9mm lower is cash and carry and will most likely end up as a pistol or a thin barreled AR type rifle? Only in MD.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,818
    They were all standard lowers so that makes sense.

    Isn't it odd that a 9mm lower is cash and carry and will most likely end up as a pistol or a thin barreled AR type rifle? Only in MD.
    LOL! I'm tellin' ya!
     

    Nickberg500

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 20, 2019
    1,064
    North of Baltimore County
    I'm sorry to be difficult but I've heard conflicting information saying since AR-9 stripped lowers are cash and carry, you do not need a 77r. Can someone point me to the specific law saying I have to do a 77r for purchasing an AR-9 stripped lower? I fear I'm not certain which tribal knowledge I'm supposed to trust, I need hard written law.
     

    grimnar15

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 21, 2019
    1,645
    I'm sorry to be difficult but I've heard conflicting information saying since AR-9 stripped lowers are cash and carry, you do not need a 77r. Can someone point me to the specific law saying I have to do a 77r for purchasing an AR-9 stripped lower? I fear I'm not certain which tribal knowledge I'm supposed to trust, I need hard written law.


    If it's a dedicated 9mm lower, then it's not an AR15 lower, so it's treated like a long gun - cash and carry. Federal and state laws still apply.
    -
     

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    Nickberg500

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 20, 2019
    1,064
    North of Baltimore County
    If it's a dedicated 9mm lower, then it's not an AR15 lower, so it's treated like a long gun - cash and carry. Federal and state laws still apply.
    -
    Thanks for posting the screenshot. That's one of the sources I'm referencing - I can't find any law saying I must go through a 77r. Since laws are inclusive, ie they only define what you can't do, not what you can do, this seems the case to me unless someone has the law or some BS interpretation from the MSP.

    That's why I need to know, if anyone has the law saying I must go through the MSP for an AR-9 on hand, please share it with me. I truly appreciate y'alls input either way
     

    grimnar15

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 21, 2019
    1,645
    Thanks for posting the screenshot. That's one of the sources I'm referencing - I can't find any law saying I must go through a 77r. Since laws are inclusive, ie they only define what you can't do, not what you can do, this seems the case to me unless someone has the law or some BS interpretation from the MSP.

    That's why I need to know, if anyone has the law saying I must go through the MSP for an AR-9 on hand, please share it with me. I truly appreciate y'alls input either way

    It is pretty clear that 77R applies to regulated firearms. A 9mm rifle is not regulated, so it is treated like that. You are still required to adhere to federal and state laws, meaning that you want to follow the proper process when building that lower into something.
     

    Nickberg500

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 20, 2019
    1,064
    North of Baltimore County
    It is pretty clear that 77R applies to regulated firearms. A 9mm rifle is not regulated, so it is treated like that. You are still required to adhere to federal and state laws, meaning that you want to follow the proper process when building that lower into something.
    What about buying a stripped lower to build a pistol? It's cash and carry with a 4473 at an FFL, the thing I'm wondering is if there's a law enforcing background checks for private sales of AR-9 stripped lowers, for the intention of making pistols?
     

    grimnar15

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 21, 2019
    1,645
    What about buying a stripped lower to build a pistol? It's cash and carry with a 4473 at an FFL, the thing I'm wondering is if there's a law enforcing background checks for private sales of AR-9 stripped lowers, for the intention of making pistols?

    Is a 9mm pistol considered a regulated firearm?
     

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