Call for Black Powder Firearm Regulation After Suicide

http://www.abc2news.com/dpp/homepage_showcase/teens-death-raises-awareness-to-black-powder-rifles

Long story short, a week ago a 14 year old ended up dead. They're calling it a suicide, but there was no note.

Anywho, the anti-gunners are now calling for 'Joshua's Law' to place the same regulations on black powder as other guns saying that it is easier to buy a black powder gun than a BB gun.

I say this: We are a state of 5.8 Million people, and this is the first time I've heard (in modern times) of a black powder firearm ending a life. They need no regulation. A gang member isn't going to carry an 1858 Remington. Someone who is going to commit suicide will still find a way.

Hope this isn't a dupe, I couldn't find one by searching 'black powder.'

Yea, cause this law coulda saved Joshua... Idiot anti gun retards.

I'm not sure of the law, but I thought if you have a child under 16 years old that passed a hunter safety course than you didn't need to lock the gun.

Also, how is a 14 old buying stuff online.

Finally, I feel for the loss. However, the parents and everybody else should come to the conclusion that if someone wants to commit suicide they will find a way. This isn't going to save the next child, it will just make the next parent shit up the creek more than this parent when the next Joshua finds the key to the lock.

Suicide is a sad, terrible thing. But, trying to shift blame for the suicide onto the inanimate object that was used, and place restrictions on everyone else, because you've now got a grudge against that inanimate object - that goes way beyond irrational.

mike_in_md said:

I'm not sure of the law, but I thought if you have a child under 16 years old that passed a hunter safety course than you didn't need to lock the gun.

Also, how is a 14 old buying stuff online.

Finally, I feel for the loss. However, the parents and everybody else should come to the conclusion that if someone wants to commit suicide they will find a way. This isn't going to save the next child, it will just make the next parent shit up the creek more than this parent when the next Joshua finds the key to the lock.

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16: like anything else.. its kinda confusing the way they wrote it. believe there is a reg on if children under 16 are in the house.. you need to have the gun locked.
14: easy.. steal dad/moms cc and order online using their name etc.

So are they calling for restrictions on sharp objects and high places? Say a seven day wait before you can cross the bay bridge.

Oh, I forgot, it's the gun.

I'm confused also because it sounds like he already had access to everything he needed. If the gun was at one house and the powder at another he could have just brought powder from one to the other. Unless it was locked up. I can't imagine losing a kid like this so condolences to the family but more regulations isn't the answer.

Let's see if I understand the story

1. Fathers best friend bought the kid a BP rifle

2. Powder and gun kept at seperate houses

3. Kid some how killed himself with it

4. Father wants Joshua's law, so kids can't buy BP firearms, which the kid never did.

This whole situation is full of fail.

So at age 13, his father's best friend bought him a black powder gun.

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So a CHILD was given a rifle yet the PARENTS of the child are looking to make a law that would have done nothing to prevent their sons death. Where is the parental responsibility here to say hey this can be dangerous maybe my son should not have access to such an it, or maybe make sure hes trained. But in the end if this was due to suicide then how do you stop a person next? Ban ropes/ bridges /tall buildings / knives give me a break here.

Eisner wants to create "Joshua's Law,” placing the same restrictions on black powder rifles as other firearms. Through Joshua's death, his eyes were opened.

"Josh would have not been able to go into Wal-Mart and buy a BB gun, but he could go online and buy a black powder pistol," said Eisner.

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What would the same restrictions matter how would they have prevented this death ? I swear when in doubt make more laws that do nothing in the end but waste tax payers time.

are they going to ban walking around downtown bmore as a white person? that's nearly suicide in itself.

mayor_quimby said:

This whole situation is full of fail.



So a CHILD was given a rifle yet the PARENTS of the child are looking to make a law that would have done nothing to prevent their sons death. Where is the parental responsibility here to say hey this can be dangerous maybe my son should not have access to such an it, or maybe make sure hes trained. But in the end if this was due to suicide then how do you stop a person next? Ban ropes/ bridges /tall buildings / knives give me a break here.




What would the same restrictions matter how would they have prevented this death ? I swear when in doubt make more laws that do nothing in the end but waste tax payers time.

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They should have a law on stupid people.

The only other BP gun suicide I remember was probably 20 years ago and over here on the shore.
A custom home builder was into civil war reenactment. He had a fling outside of marriage and wound up shooting himself in the chest with cap and ball revolver in confederate uniform.

Speculation on my part,maybe not a suicide but an AD/ND while loading/unloading .Alot of info is missing.

Let the hand-wringing begin ...

Suicide is tragic, but so is culpability and denial. Even with proper understanding, intervention, and treatment, sometimes the end is unavoidable. Blaming whatever 'thing' for a tradgedy that only the person who was suffering could explain is wrong-headed and only adds to the misunderstanding in what could ultimately save other lives.

Not another useless gun control law!
ENOUGH!

call them "muzzleloaders" -- the black powder is irrelevant

Even though most people in this thread is using the terminology "black powder firearms," I am not aware of anything in Maryland law that actually makes a distinction between firearms based on what kind of gun powder is employed. The critical distinction, in the law, is in what kind of ignition system the firearm employs. The most accurate shorthand to use with a general audience is to refer to "muzzle loaders."

Basically, Maryland law -- modeled after federal law -- does not regulate transfers of what are defined as "antique" firearms. In the Maryland statutes, the key definition is found in the Criminal Law Article, Section 4-201, as follows:

b) Antique firearm. -- "Antique firearm" means:

(1) a firearm, including a firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar ignition system, manufactured before 1899; OR

(2) a replica of a firearm described in item (1) of this subsection that:

(i) is not designed or redesigned to use rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition; OR

(ii) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition that is no longer manufactured in the United States and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

(I have capitalized the use of "or" for emphasis.)

Keep in mind that a muzzleloading rifle or pistol clearly falls within the definition of "firearm" in Maryland law (found in Public Safety Article Section 5-101):

Firearm. --

(1) "Firearm" means:

(i) a weapon that expels, is designed to expel, or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; or

(ii) the frame or receiver of such a weapon.

But a muzzleloader is not a regulated firearm, because it is an "antique" as defined above, and "antique" firearms are explicitly excluded from the state requirements that govern transfer of handguns and other regulated weapons.

However, a firearm made after 1898 that fires rimfire or conventional centerfire cartridges that are "readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade" -- which, nowadays, includes a lot of archaic calibers and loads -- is NOT an "antique," even if it is a faithful replica of a firearm made 100 years ago. For example, Pedersoli makes replicas of the old Sharps breechloaders. Some of them are rated for black powder cartridges only, and some for smokeless powder cartridges as well -- but it simply does not matter for regulatory purposes what kind of powder they are rated for. NONE of them are "antiques," under either federal or Maryland law, because they are cartridge-firing breechloaders, and therefore are treated just like modern rifles under the law.

So then: Rather than referring to "black powder firearms," I think that it is better to refer to the non-regulated firearms generically as "muzzle loaders." That terminology more accurately reflects the actual terms of the law, although not perfectly. It is also more helpful terminology to use in arguing against unnecessary restrictions. For those of our fellow citizens who do not know much about guns, it is not readily apparent why the type of gunpowder should matter, but most people know that a "muzzleloader" is an old-fashioned gun, comparatively slow and difficult to load, and not a likely choice for those who are intending to do harm.

Brychan said:

Let's see if I understand the story

1. Fathers best friend bought the kid a BP rifle

2. Powder and gun kept at seperate houses

3. Kid some how killed himself with it

4. Father wants Joshua's law, so kids can't buy BP firearms, which the kid never did.

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Exactly, the kid didn't buy the gun anyway, so additional regulation would have not changed this. He had also had it for over a year, so a waiting period wouldn't have done jack.

Kman said:

The only other BP gun suicide I remember was probably 20 years ago and over here on the shore.
A custom home builder was into civil war reenactment. He had a fling outside of marriage and wound up shooting himself in the chest with cap and ball revolver in confederate uniform.

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That's hardcore....




This just all seems so weird. How do they think that additional laws would have prevented this?

Won't someone think of the children?

Seriously though, suicide makes me sad but a truly suicidal person has many options. There are buses, trains, trucks, bridges, pills, CO2, knifes, ropes, etc.

Taking guns away won't stop suicides.

WeaponsCollector said:

Not another useless gun control law!
ENOUGH!

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Sadly, too many people believe that bad things happen solely because there wasn't a law, specifically written, to prevent each and every specific tragedy in life.