Combat load

Fl1p · Jun 17, 2020

Does anybody know off hand how many rounds are in a military combat load for a shotgun? I know the M4 is 7 mags(210 rds) but I can’t find anything for shotgun.

Catch-10-22 · Jun 17, 2020

It sounds like there isn't a good answer because of the roles that shotguns play in combat are so varied (breaching, MP, etc.). There is a very long thread on it here. Seems like the answer is about 50 rounds in addition to what is in/on the shotgun. Since shotgun ammo is 3.8-1 the weight of a 5.56 round, that also pretty much works out to be equivalent to the weight to 210 rounds of 5.56mm ammo (not counting mags, not exact math, close enough).

willtill · Jun 17, 2020

As many shells as you can stuff into yer pockets.

Fl1p · Jun 17, 2020

Thanks for the info guys. I’m trying to store 3 “combat loads” with each of my long arms and just making sure I maintain minimums.

smokey · Jun 17, 2020

Fl1p said:
Thanks for the info guys. I’m trying to store 3 “combat loads” with each of my long arms and just making sure I maintain minimums.

For grab and go, look into what 3-gun folks are doing with belt rigs. Get a belt with shell caddies all loaded up you can just wrap on in a hurry.

Lloyd · Jun 17, 2020

I think you won't find a "doctrine" type answer given that a shotgun is rarely a primary weapon system, and in modern times, shotguns were most often only used for breaching.

.

pbharvey · Jun 17, 2020

These are cheap and handy. For $20 you have ammo onboard your weapon when you grab it as well as a fast and convenient way to carry 50 additional rounds.

jimbobborg · Jun 18, 2020

Shotguns are slow enough to reload as it is, why handicap yourself with a bandolier?

willtill · Jun 18, 2020

jimbobborg said:
Shotguns are slow enough to reload as it is, why handicap yourself with a bandolier?

Sort of the same premise as storing mags in a pouch. What is important is being ambulatory with spare ammunition on your person.

I like those shotgun stocks with a cutout that allows a couple more shells to be squirreled away. Second would be the receiver mounted side saddle for shells.

pbharvey · Jun 18, 2020

jimbobborg said:
Shotguns are slow enough to reload as it is, why handicap yourself with a bandolier?

The beauty of a shotgun is you can reload as you go. Pump a few out of the tube then push a few new ones up the tube. That said, a shotgun is not a good weapon for sustained gunfire.

sgt23preston · Jun 18, 2020

willtill said:
As many shells as you can stuff into yer pockets.

The winning answer for lifes close encounters...

erwos · Jun 18, 2020

smokey0118 said:
For grab and go, look into what 3-gun folks are doing with belt rigs. Get a belt with shell caddies all loaded up you can just wrap on in a hurry.

Notably, the 3gun guys in Open, who have no equipment restrictions, all run mag-fed shotguns. That is a clue as to what's really the fastest way to keep a shotgun fed, which is to say... mags off your belt from an HSGI HCM or similar. The quad-load gear can get you fast reloads on a tube gun, but it is bulky and somewhat prone to losing shells when going prone or banging off barriers. (Never mind that most shotguns also don't quad load terribly well without some gunsmithing work to open the port up, etc.)

I don't think the military shotgun loadout is very useful as a civilian benchmark, unless you are planning on going into a combat zone to breach doors or guard installations for a day or two at a time. Most people who are going to be using shotguns CONUS are going to be using them for home defense, and a loaded extended tube with a side saddle seems like more than enough firepower for any conceivable HD situation.

Rambler · Jun 18, 2020

This one I have not seen in person. But the other products he makes are very high quality.

https://olongapooutfitters.com/equipment-and-gear/shotgun-grab-and-go/

MacGuns · Jun 18, 2020

EODJoe · Jun 18, 2020

My 870 is set up with a six round tube, six shell sidesaddle, and a speed feed stock that holds an additional four rounds. I have a Surefire fore end and 3 point sling set up. I also have a bandolier with it holding another 25 rounds. I can grab and go in the dark and be confident that if I need to engage a target, wherever the Surefire points then buckshot will follow. Practice loading on the go and in low light conditions helps too.

alucard0822 · Jun 18, 2020

smokey0118 said:
For grab and go, look into what 3-gun folks are doing with belt rigs. Get a belt with shell caddies all loaded up you can just wrap on in a hurry.

IMO the answer is as few as possible. No way I would rely on a shotgun as a primary weapon given the choice, or 3 gun style shell caddies. dual/quad loading caddies spit shells out any time they take a decent bump, the old style top loading (single stack) caddies are more secure, but as with all things shotgun, slow and bulky. IMO if a shotgun is needed for breeching, a serbu with a few breeching slugs stored out of the way of the primary weapon would be fine(if charges or a ram couldn't be used). If it was an issued weapon for an MP, PD or so, then a couple single stack caddies and maybe a small pouch of loose shells would probably be the way to go. Seemed to be the rig of choice in tac shotgun classes I've attended. The average class or competition carbine vs shotgun stage/drill usually makes the Carbine's superiority as a primary weapon pretty obvious.

onedash · Jun 18, 2020

When it runs dry, throw it on the ground and pick up your next weapon, possibly from the people you killed with your shotgun, or where you had them strategically placed along your combat route. eg. John Wick 2.

Fl1p · Jun 18, 2020

Thanks for all the reply’s guys. Mostly I’m trying to maintain reasonable ammo stores while still budgeting for training and fun range days. While the shotgun definitely isn’t my go to for a long gun in most situations, I feel that it is often thought of as antiquated tech. I think for a rainy day weapon the shotgun is very versatile and would make a great camp/cabin/homestead longarm.

I think I’m going to try and say 30 shells of buckshot and 15 slugs are a “combat load. I’ll try to maintain 3x that number for each shotgun in the house, with extra shells going to my training stores and fun shoot stores.

hogarth · Jun 18, 2020

I must confess I don't understand what any of this is about. What does it matter what a US military "standard load out" is? Does any of that apply to you? Do you have the same logistics advantages and disadvantages as the US military (which is at least partly how they determine such things)? I know ex Delta and Devgru guys who went on missions with three mags, and some who took a dozen. Sometimes it depended on how many buddies were with them, were they operating from vehicles, were they also wearing body armor (weight/mobility becomes an issue), backpack, etc.

MISSION DRIVES THE GEAR TRAIN

Figure out YOUR mission and plan accordingly.

Fl1p · Jun 18, 2020

Yeah, I get that mission drives gear, but planning for an unknown mission is difficult. While I would love to buy 10,000 rds of buckshot and another 5,000 of slugs for my ammo stores, but with ammo prices on the rise, I need to plan accordingly with my ammo budget. Just trying to get 3 “combat loads” but away for each long arm before adding new guns or increasing stores on heavily used rounds 9mm and 556)

Combat load

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