Any Negatives

So I just purchased my first two guns (a Berretta A400 3.5" Shotgun and a PSA KS-47) so can officially apply for my C&R license. My understanding is I'll need to http://www.atf.gov/forms/dcof/ and order the correct form (F 7CR (5310.16) - Application for License (Collector of Curios and Relics) os Under 18 U.S.C. Chapter 44, Firearms) and fill it out properly and sent it to the ATF and my CLEO. Once it's approved I'll get something returned in the mail.

I'm just curious is there any negatives to getting a C&R license? I know I'll need to keep a bound book with my details on my C&R weapons but is there anything else? Like is there extra paperwork and/or inspections I'll have to do in the future b/c of it. Or does it disqualify me from anything?

Also curious if anyone has any recommendations on what I should purchase. I think I'm looking at purchasing 2 handguns a TT-33 and then some revolver. I'd like to spend somewhere less then $1,500 total. Any recommendations for the revolver? Not looking for anything special just something fun to shoot and look good on the wall/safe.

Thanks

I think you are confusing Maryland Designated Collector and C&R FFL03. You do not need to purchase anything to get an FFL03.

Shooter_McGavin said:

So I just purchased my first two guns (a Berretta A400 3.5" Shotgun and a PSA KS-47) so can officially apply for my C&R license. My understanding is I'll need to http://www.atf.gov/forms/dcof/ and order the correct form (F 7CR (5310.16) - Application for License (Collector of Curios and Relics) os Under 18 U.S.C. Chapter 44, Firearms) and fill it out properly and sent it to the ATF and my CLEO. Once it's approved I'll get something returned in the mail.

I'm just curious is there any negatives to getting a C&R license? I know I'll need to keep a bound book with my details on my C&R weapons but is there anything else? Like is there extra paperwork and/or inspections I'll have to do in the future b/c of it. Or does it disqualify me from anything?

Also curious if anyone has any recommendations on what I should purchase. I think I'm looking at purchasing 2 handguns a TT-33 and then some revolver. I'd like to spend somewhere less then $1,500 total. Any recommendations for the revolver? Not looking for anything special just something fun to shoot and look good on the wall/safe.

Thanks

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Positives: C&R shipped to your house, no transfer fees
Negatives: ??? Only negative is that some people online do not ship a C&R rifle to a C&R holder. Kinda dumb

C&R is great. Make sure you get a bound book and keep other people's C&R forms when you receive a firearm. Keep your original copy (do NOT sign it) and make photocopies for the "wet ink" signed forms you need to make transactions. The ATF can technically inspect your book, however they typically will call you and ask you to present to a local field office. To my knowledge, there will be no random house inspections. Never happened to me but it's what I've read online.

What to purchase: Colt 1917's (revolver) in .45ACP, or smith and wessons in .38 spl etc pop up once in a while if you're looking for relatively cheap revolvers. If I were you, I would also look at long guns too. Simpson LTD has a decent selection of C&R firearms for decent prices. I've bought a few things there and never had an issue.

Also- what the other use said. No need to purchase anything to get a C&R. I sent my form to my CLEO and didn't hear a peep. Not sure if the ATF contacts the CLEO, probably not. But it's required

Besides the thread title?

Bertfish said:

Besides the thread title?

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Well, there is that whole "bank account regularly drops to ramen-noodles-for-breakfast-lunch-and-dinner level of funds" aspect, but it's hardly a negative when you have all the guns you ever wanted and then some!

Bertfish said:

Besides the thread title?

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It is in the C&R Sub, so there is that.

tallen702 said:

Well, there is that whole "bank account regularly drops to ramen-noodles-for-breakfast-lunch-and-dinner level of funds" aspect, but it's hardly a negative when you have all the guns you ever wanted and then some!

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I like ramen...

tallen702 said:

Well, there is that whole "bank account regularly drops to ramen-noodles-for-breakfast-lunch-and-dinner level of funds" aspect, but it's hardly a negative when you have all the guns you ever wanted and then some!

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Heard that. I blew my "C&R funds" load really early this year. There were some gems on gunbroker that I couldn't resist. Oh well, no one has ever complained they owned too many historical artifacts. I've found that I have had quite a bit more liquid this year due to not paying for gas, eating out, etc as much with working from home. So that helped...

If you think you will become a collector of Curio & Relic firearms, no negative to getting C&R FFL03 for a law abiding citizen in my eyes.

Sending a copy of your FFL03 to online gun businesses like Brownell's will bring you a discount on many or most items. You'll get your thiry bucks back in discounts pretty quickly.

The below appears to be incorrect. I got my FFL in 2015 and I apparently misread the regulations

You have to keep records of ALL firearms you buy or sell after you get the C&R. Not just C&R firearms. You don't have to record any existing firearms you have unless you sell one, then you add it to your records as sold.

This part is still correct.
And remember, it's not just firearms older than 50 years that qualify as C&R. The ATF has a PDF file listing other firearms that are considered collectible, less than 50 years old. Typical are commemorative firearms. Even the Polish P64 9x18 Makarov is considered collectible.

And as an item of interest:

The Bound Book can be a three ring binder.

JohnC said:

...What to purchase: Colt 1917's (revolver) in .45ACP, or smith and wessons in .38 spl etc pop up once in a while if you're looking for relatively cheap revolvers...

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Ok, where are you finding cheap Colt 1917s? I'll buy one tonight.

gwfrench said:

You have to keep records of ALL firearms you buy or sell after you get the C&R. Not just C&R firearms. You don't have to record any existing firearms you have unless you sell one, then you add it to your records as sold.

And remember, it's not just firearms older than 50 years that qualify as C&R. The ATF has a PDF file listing other firearms that are considered collectible, less than 50 years old. Typical are commemorative firearms. Even the Polish P64 9x18 Makarov is considered collectible.

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Small correction to the above statement. You don't have to keep records of ALL firearms you buy and sell after you get your C&R. Only C&R firearm acquisition and dispositions are tracked in your bound book. Firearms that are not C&R qualified you can track however you want.

gwfrench said:

You have to keep records of ALL firearms you buy or sell after you get the C&R. Not just C&R firearms. You don't have to record any existing firearms you have unless you sell one, then you add it to your records as sold.

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Sorry, but this is incredibly incorrect.

C&R eligible firearms are the only firearms that have to be entered into your bound book. I think you may be getting confused with the fact that you can't pick and choose which C&R eligible firearms you "use" your license for or not and thus, which ones would have to be entered or not.

A good example is that here in MD, your C&R does nothing for you if you buy a C&R handgun from a FFL or other individual in-state because handguns are regulated in MD and subject to a state-level background check. So, let's say you buy a P64 from So. Carroll Sporting Goods. Brian is going to run the 77R and 4473 because it's the law. He doesn't book it as a FFL to FFL transfer going your way, but you DO have to book it in as a FFL to FFL transfer in your book even though it wasn't done that way because the gun itself is eligible and therefore, as a licensee, you have to book it in. There were some in the community a while back that argued you only had to book in guns that were transferred FFL to FFL (no NICS or other BGC) but the BATFE put that to bed a while later.

That said, it only matters for C&R eligible firearms. So that part about booking everything in is wrong.

As for the part about having to record the disposition of firearms that you acquired before getting your license. That's a gray area at best. Generally speaking, they don't have to be entered into the bound book as they were acquired prior to licensing and thus, were not subject to a FFL to FFL transaction. As such, they likely do not have to be recorded for disposition unless you are disposing of them to another C&R FFL. Even then you would need to "Acquire" it in the book and then dispose of it as disposition records must match acquisition records.

It's my understanding you have to log in a C&R firearm to your book (as "from personal collection" etc) when disposing of one that was acquired before the license was active. You don't have to enter it into the book until it's disposed of, but it has to be logged in and then out as a disposition. It doesn't matter who it goes to, another licensee or an unlicensed individual.

"478.125 Record of receipt and disposition (f) Firearms receipt and disposition by licensed collectors... Each licensed collector shall enter into a record each receipt and disposition of firearms curios or relics..... The record shall show the date of the sale or other disposition of each firearm curio or relic, the name and address of the person to whom the firearm curio or relic is transferred, or the name and license number of the person to whom transferred if such person is a licensee, and the date of birth of the transferee if other than a licensee."

It's not a bad idea to keep records of non-C&R acquisitions and dispositions, but don't do it in your C&R Bound Book