Biden does it again! State Dept. Bans Russian Guns and Ammo

Biggfoot44 said:

In theory the harder steel rims would some degree accelerate extractor wear . But as erows points out that between the bimetal jackets and the powders , bore erosion is the big problem .

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Well and generally not very accurate and dirty.

Though my SKS loves Wolf mil Classic ammo. Shoots better than 2MOA with it somehow. But I’ve yet to meet a steel cased 223 that’ll do better than 4MOA out of my ARs and typically more like 5-6. Most of my guns, take whatever cheap commodity brass cased range ammo I have and make it about 25% less accurate. Not always, I have met some brass cased range ammo that’s worse than your typical Tula, but rarely. Now it’s not all equal. Barnul seems to be better than typical for steel cased ammo. Hornady steel match is quite accurate.

lazarus said:

Well and generally not very accurate and dirty.

Though my SKS loves Wolf mil Classic ammo. Shoots better than 2MOA with it somehow. But I’ve yet to meet a steel cased 223 that’ll do better than 4MOA out of my ARs and typically more like 5-6. Most of my guns, take whatever cheap commodity brass cased range ammo I have and make it about 25% less accurate. Not always, I have met some brass cased range ammo that’s worse than your typical Tula, but rarely. Now it’s not all equal. Barnul seems to be better than typical for steel cased ammo. Hornady steel match is quite accurate.

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You got to find better barrels. I shoot wolf and Barnaul all day out past 200 yards on c zone / a zone targets and have no issues making hits. I shot wolf out of my AR for a 800 agg high power match without much issue as well.

With my 74, gun is a laser beam with wolf / red army and barnaul out past 200.

With my 47 I love the look on peoples face when I hit the A zone bonus at 200 yards during a 3 gun.

All well under the 2MOA using a primary arms red dot. My WWSD out shoots me with steel cases. That faxon barrel is amazing.

Now golden tiger… different story basically a non stop shotgun pattern out of all my toys. My sks loves it though.

One clarification on my post: lot to lot steel case is awful.

Run through a batch, you’d better re zero as it’s going to be way off. I don’t see that same effect with brass

Oh , it's possible to produce crappy brass case ammo , or reasonably decent steel case .


It's just that prior to August 2021 , that most steel ammo also overlapping with absolutely least expensive to mfg , to sell for low retail price . ( The exception was Hornaday , that had a product line that started with steel primed cases , with Hornaday bullets , and good QC of loading ).

Expect to soon see crappier brass case ammo to split the difference with Wolf price point .

Russian ammo will still be imported as usual for at least another two years-- possibly in larger quantities-- and possibly for longer if Russia complies with sanction terms( not likely)

The September date is for the application of new import contacts. Contracts are 2years in duration. And the state department will continue to honor existing contracts after September 7th. Luckily importers were aware and prepared with contracts updated and in order.

US and non-Russian manufacturers will fill the supply void as the contacts expire.

Its called capitalism. And the law of supply and demand.
Ban Panic turned out to be a nothing burger.

Thanks, internet!

Dan44 said:

Someone else will take up the slack, just like when Chinese ammo was cut off in the 90s.

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Seriously?
Did you somehow forget about the last three decades?
Because Russia picked up the slack when the Chinese ammo stopped.

It's called capitalism.

When there's a huge profit to be made, someone (or mulitple someones) ALWAYS picks up the slack.

Besides, I'd rather spend a few cents more per round and give my money to American ammo suppliers and importers of ammo from our foreign allies than to Russia

F**k Russia and Putin.

US and Non Russia Mfgs will certainly * React * to the void . "Filling" it in the context of same quantity at same price point is a whole different thing .

Basic Rational Economic Behavior - US and other mfgs with increase the production of so called. commie calibers somewhat . They will use their existing brass and copper jacket technology instead of starting from scratch to develop Steel case manufacturing . The prices will be higher than Russian , if only for the raw material and manufacturing costs .

Consumers will then cumulatively purchase less than previous , either by not shooting their commie guns , or shooting them less , and shooting other guns additionally . Eventually , the supply and the demand will settle to their mutual level . We'll see who Liked AK and SKS platforms , and the 7.62 x 39 on purpose , and who just used them as a launching platform for cheap ammo .

US and Non Russia Mfgs will certainly * React * to the void . "Filling" it in the context of same quantity at same price point is a whole different thing .

Basic Rational Economic Behavior - US and other mfgs with increase the production of so called. commie calibers somewhat . They will use their existing brass and copper jacket technology instead of starting from scratch to develop Steel case manufacturing . The prices will be higher than Russian , if only for the raw material and manufacturing costs .

Consumers will then cumulatively purchase less than previous , either by not shooting their commie guns , or shooting them less , and shooting other guns additionally . Eventually , the supply and the demand will settle to their mutual level . We'll see who Liked AK and SKS platforms , and the 7.62 x 39 on purpose , and who just used them as a launching platform for cheap ammo .

no big deal. Not a fan of third world ammo, anyway

Yes , But ............

Lots of people Are , and it's a significant % of total ammo sales in the US .

Some users will sharply curtail their ammo consumption . Many of them will now be competing with you for " your " prefered " ammo , including common Pistol calibers . Supply/ Demand . Prices will rise ( or at least slow the gradual price drop ).

So its OK for the terrorist that attacked us on 9/11 to have M4s and AK47s and premium ammunition, paid for by the American tax payer. Yet God forbid we have a rifle and cheap Russian ammo. F@#&$ those politicians.

DO NOT go into panic mode. There is too much money to be made. Russian will simply ship the ammo to a former satellite country, it will packaged and shipped from there. Most of our honey still comes from China despite Chinese honey import embargos. The Chinese just ship it to Vietnam or Indonesia where its packaged and sent here. so RELAX.

engineerbrian said:

Didnt something like this happen recently and they shifted production to Romania?

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That's correct. Looks like Romania will be getting some more business.

dieselfarmboy said:

Some dont have the means to. Was trying to grow my business. Had a truck go down and had to replace it with a over priced used one. This year has sucked and isnt even over.

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I have found 2021 has sucked even worse than 2020! I can only imagine 2022.

lemmdus said:

DO NOT go into panic mode. There is too much money to be made. Russian will simply ship the ammo to a former satellite country, it will packaged and shipped from there. Most of our honey still comes from China despite Chinese honey import embargos. The Chinese just ship it to Vietnam or Indonesia where its packaged and sent here. so RELAX.

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I believe the issue is around country of ORIGIN, not country of re-boxing/trans-shipping. It's on the naughty list if it's made in Russia, whether or not it's boxed up as a Romanian or a Latvian retail product.

Considering that Russians, Chinese and other nations that couldn't care less about following laws when it's to their benefit, it can't be difficult for them to either change the head stamps to hide the country of origin or set up factories in countries allied with them that also sell to the US.

Doug Hile said:

no big deal. Not a fan of third world ammo, anyway

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I don't need my AR15 cause you have your hunting rifle too right?

What don't people like you get about this divide and conquer mentality? It's an attack on all of us

Hecktor Peabody said:

Russian ammo will still be imported as usual for at least another two years-- possibly in larger quantities-- and possibly for longer if Russia complies with sanction terms( not likely)

The September date is for the application of new import contacts. Contracts are 2years in duration. And the state department will continue to honor existing contracts after September 7th. Luckily importers were aware and prepared with contracts updated and in order.

US and non-Russian manufacturers will fill the supply void as the contacts expire.

Its called capitalism. And the law of supply and demand.
Ban Panic turned out to be a nothing burger.

Thanks, internet!

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Glad to see a liberal gun owner is here to troll. Go back to your hole where you can grovel over your daddy Biden’s backdoor gun control measures.

Guarantee you’d be saying the same thing if/when they pass another kind of import ban on semi-automatic rifles/pistols. “Capitalism will take care of it” “you should be buying American anyway”.

You’re part of the reason why we’re dealing with this bullsh*t.

This was just sent out by Sam at SGAmmo "There has been a lot of people asking me about the sanctions on Russian ammo imports put in place by the US state department this past week and what it means for the future of ammunition supplies. There will be more clarity in several weeks when we can see the publication of a Federal Register notice expected on September 7, 2021. The state department announcement can be seen at this page - https://www.state.gov/fact-sheet-un...-russia-for-the-poisoning-of-aleksey-navalny/

My Russian Ammo Sanction Opinion - First, I hope you don't 'shoot the messenger' and I'd like to pat everyone on the back and tell them things are going to be okay but that wouldn't be truthful. In my opinion the sanctions are a major game-changer in the ammunition supply chain that is already strained. For the time being and based on what we can see so far, we believe that this will be the effective end of Russian made ammo in the USA as it plays out over the next year or so as import permits expire or are filled to the quantity limits, and in doing so eliminate supply of a huge portion of the ammo in the US commercial market. From what I understand, the USA commercial market consumes around 800,000,000 rounds of ammunition from Russia every year, roughly 800 semi truck trailers worth in a mix of the most popular calibers. For the immediate short term we expect ammo to keep coming in from Russia but I expect the importers to raise prices substantially which is understandable to me given its the end of the lifespan for their business model. The calibers we believe will be most effected are soviet metric calibers like 7.62x39, 5.45x39, and 7.62x54R because there is almost zero available manufacturing capacity for these calibers outside of Russia and what little exists will not make a significant impact in filling the needs of the USA commercial market without Russian ammo absorbing the lion's share. In addition to these calibers, I estimate that the Russians supplied 30% to 40% of the 223 Rem / 5.56 and 9mm Luger consumed at the shooting ranges across this country, and large portions of the 45 auto, 9x18 Makarov, 30 carbine, 308 Winchester / 762x51, 380 Auto, 300 Blackout and 6.5 Grendel. I see this as a potentially devastating blow to the supply for of 223 Rem / 5.56 and 9mm Luger, where the reduction in supply from Russia will be difficult to make up in the short term for other manufacturers who have already been unable to keep up with demand this past year. Consumers who have used Russian ammo regularly will have to move on from Russian made ammo to those other products made elsewhere and in doing so absorb the supply and prolong recent shortages. Again this is my opinion, based on my knowledge of the industry after 20+ years experience, and how things play out over time could be different. For me, selling Russian made ammo is about 40% of my business, and while we plan to source as much supply as we can from other sources, we do expect this to have a major negative impact on supply for 7.62x39, 7.62x54R, 5.45x39, 9mm Makarov, 9mm Luger, 223 Rem / 5.56 NATO, as well as the other mentioned calibers."

Occam said:

I believe the issue is around country of ORIGIN, not country of re-boxing/trans-shipping. It's on the naughty list if it's made in Russia, whether or not it's boxed up as a Romanian or a Latvian retail product.

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Correct. Bypassing sanctions is a big deal.