Black Powder Shotgun

[dukezern]

Can anyone give me information on this old shotgun. I purchased it at a gun show to hang above the fireplace. I have searched this thing and find no manufacturer markings on it at all. It's nothing exotic, but appears to be a basic "work horse" kind of shotgun.

Some of these photos are a little blurry. Sorry about that, guys. I did my best. Also, if someone could tell me where to look to find some markets, that would be helpful. I've avoided taking the front stock off because of the wedge pins in there but if that's where I would find some markings, I'll give it a shot. This things is also pretty long by today's shotgun standards at 55 1/2".

Let me know if more photos would be helpful, and exactly what part of the shotgun I should photograph.

Thank you!!

 

[Clovis]

Can't say for sure, not an expert. Kinda looks like a musket. It could handle shot but it is difficult to tell.

Can you post a full picture and a measurement of the muzzle?

 

[dukezern]

Thank you so much for your response, Clovis. The muzzle is exactly 40". Attached is a photo of the entire shotgun. And yeah, I guess it could be a musket but it has no sights and the end of the ramrod is flat. That's why I thought it would be a shotgun.

 

[Clovis]

Thanks for the photo Dukezern.

Um, I was looking for the diameter of the internal portion of the barrel at the muzzle. This measurement should give a clue to caliber or gauge.

The lines on the whole photo still doesn't look completely like a fowler or a musket. Could have been converted at one time to be something completely different from original.

Now, is it loaded? Many old guns are found to have been left loaded and can still discharge. The ramrod looks a little shorter than the barrel. Get a cleaning rod that is longer than the barrel length and put it in the barrel. Hold you fingers where it comes to and measure the distance along the outside of the barrel. If it does not go to the breech or at least very close, it may have a load in it. If it does, take it to a gunsmith.

 

[LONGSHOT]

does the round metal part next to the hammer rotate to exspose the breech.

 

[epps1919]

Look just below the nipple, it looks like the barrel has had a plug put in it, this gun must have been a flint lock originally then converted to percussion.

 

[epps1919]

The hammer looks like a blacksmith made it and the lock plate dose not fit the stock right on the front part.

 

[dukezern]

Clovis, I am so sorry for such a late response! Things got pretty nuts last week with the power outages, then the death of a friend.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. When you said "measurement of the muzzleloader", I mind went to length and thought you must have meant barrel length. The diameter of the muzzle is just under 3/4", meaning it must certainly be a 12 gauge. I think a 12 gauge is .729" in diameter, so I'm sure that's what it is. This is definitely the Real McCoy, I'm just having a difficult time finding someone who can give me some information on it. I think it's particularly tough when it really has no manufacturer markings on it.

 

[dukezern]

So sorry for the late response, brother. No, it does not rotate to expose the breach.

 

[dukezern]

Yeah, I see exactly what you're speaking of. I had not noticed that before. It's my understanding that such conversions back then were not uncommon. I'm pretty up on the modern day firearms but these pieces from a couple hundred years ago throw me for a real loop!

 

[dukezern]

epps1919. I guess it could definitely be a conversion, then. That's what it looks like. Sounds like you know what you're talking about. I had never noticed any of those things!

 

[epps1919]

I think it is a 12ga shoot gun [not military] Because of the barrel wage pins and the barrel is octagon to round and the stock is to short. to be a military arm.

 

[Clovis]

Clovis, I am so sorry for such a late response! Things got pretty nuts last week with the power outages, then the death of a friend.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. When you said "measurement of the muzzleloader", I mind went to length and thought you must have meant barrel length. The diameter of the muzzle is just under 3/4", meaning it must certainly be a 12 gauge. I think a 12 gauge is .729" in diameter, so I'm sure that's what it is. This is definitely the Real McCoy, I'm just having a difficult time finding someone who can give me some information on it. I think it's particularly tough when it really has no manufacturer markings on it.

Not a problem dukezern. I am sorry to hear of your loss.


Looks like to me the gun is likely a dedicated fowler converted from flint to cap and I cannot think of any military muskets that went from octogon to round barrels. The diameter of the bore is about what the old brown bess muskets were. I would not expect to see a makers mark or signature as it looks to have been a working gun and may have been made by a local smith to provide personal income. Should make a great wall hanger.

 

[Biggfoot44]

.72 Cal was also a common musket bore size. While the military loadings were commonly either round ball , or buck and ball , they could also be loaded with shot.

Since it doesn't seem to be stocked as a Fowling Piece , the best wild guess is that it started as a flintlock Musked in late 1700's to early 1800's . Somewhere along the line was either liberated or sold as surplus ( or give as trade goods , or what ever ). At some point in mid 1800 it was converted to percussion and/or "sporterized" by a local gunsmith/ blacksmith to be used as a utility gun.