PSA - BWMC installing gun detectors

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  • Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,853
    Glen Burnie
    I am a physician, and I was referring to hospital resident training.
    Aside from the obvious teaching campuses like John's Hopkins and UofMd in the city, which hospitals are armed that would be in "these parts"? Meaning AA, PG, Balt county.

    I've seen a ton of hospital security job listings and none I recall were armed.
    Always looking for a retirement gig but no way I'd do it unarmed.
     

    chuck

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 1, 2016
    1,546
    Anne Arundel
    I went to a Philadelphia hospital that had these. Got flagged for phone chargers, glasses cases and keys. There seemed to be a lot of false positives so security was quick to let people move on.
     

    dbledoc

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Apr 8, 2013
    1,541
    Howard County
    Aside from the obvious teaching campuses like John's Hopkins and UofMd in the city, which hospitals are armed that would be in "these parts"? Meaning AA, PG, Balt county.

    I've seen a ton of hospital security job listings and none I recall were armed.
    Always looking for a retirement gig but no way I'd do it unarmed.
    In this area (MoCo) the security guards are unarmed. However, the hospitals I go to have at least 1 or 2 local PD officers around in the ED.
     

    BurkeM

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2014
    1,788
    Baltimore
    shooting in emergency room
    Well, these really are exceptional scenarios, certainly around these parts. Definitely not what they were thinking when making the decision to install them.
    Your ignorance doesn't mean it isn't happening.


    2019

    A gunman shot and killed an emergency physician, a pharmacy resident, and a police officer at Chicago's Mercy Hospital in November, leaving the emergency physicians there reeling from the experience. They cycled through every emotion imaginable, from fear to guilt, but they were able to glean some lessons from their harrowing experience.

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10126164/ 1993 May

    The shootings of three doctors in a Los Angeles emergency room, and the subsequent hostage taking by the alleged assailant, received extensive national publicity and reportedly has had an impact on ER security at many hospitals--in California and elsewhere. In Part I of this report, we'll present details on what happened and what transpired afterward in connection with the hospital, Los Angeles County-University of Southern California Medical Center, and other California hospitals. Part II of this report, in our next issue, will deal with the event's impact on hospitals elsewhere in the country.

    ------------------

    2 DEAD, 5 WOUNDED AFTER ER SHOOTING PATIENT DIES OF HEART ATTACK AS WOMAN KILLS ANOTHER BEFORE POLICE SHOOT HER​


    A woman fired gunshots in a hospital emergency room Monday night, killing another woman and wounding that woman's husband before she was shot by police, authorities said.

    Another woman who was being treated for a gunshot wound when the shootings erupted died of a heart attack.

    Police said the shootings stemmed from a domestic fight.

    According to John Mitchell, a spokesman for Chippenham Hospital, three people - a 50-year-old woman, a 26-year-old woman and a 3-year-old boy - arrived about 7:45 p.m. suffering from gunshot wounds. They were brought in by a husband and wife.

    Minutes later, Mitchell said, a 45-year-old woman came into the emergency room and began shooting.

    Both the husband and wife were shot, the wife fatally.

    The husband was in surgery, Mitchell said.

    The woman doing the shooting was in stable condition with wounds that were not life-threatening, Mitchell said.

    During the shootings, the 50-year-old woman suffered a heart attack and died, Mitchell said.

    The conditions of the younger woman and the boy who came in with gunshot wounds were not immediately known.

    Authorities were withholding the names of the victims.

    ---------------

    Jul 28, 2023

    This week, a visitor opened fire at Legacy Good Samaritan Medical Center in Portland, killing a security guard and injuring a nurse.

    Following increases in both aggression towards nurses and mass shootings, stakeholders are debating whether new tech or old solutions can make a difference.

    ---------------
    A shooting in a Virginia hospital on Dec. 22 ended with two people injured and one suspect charged, according to the Richmond Times-Dispatch.


    Police said a 27-year-old man, Rasheed Pope Jr., had a firearm during the intake process at Chippenham Hospital, an HCA Healthcare facility in Richmond, Va., on Dec. 22. Police on site at the hospital for an unrelated matter were notified of the shooting at 4:11 a.m., which occurred in the hospital's ER.


    Police said Mr. Pope self-presented at the hospital for a mental health evaluation and was entering a room and getting into a gown when, without warning, he began firing his weapon, according to a Dec. 22 police news conference made available from local CBS affiliate WTVR.


    The shooting injured a Chesterfield County police officer and a male patient who was in the hallway, police said. Police said the officer was treated for injuries and released; the patient's injuries were considered critical but not life-threatening. Police said the shooting was not accidental, with multiple shots fired.


    Police arrested Mr. Pope on the scene. He has been charged with attempted murder and use of a firearm in the commission of a felony.

    -------------------

    On November 19, 2018, a mass shooting took place at the Mercy Hospital and Medical Center in Chicago, Illinois. An attending physician at the hospital, a police officer, and a pharmacy resident were killed. The gunman, later identified as Juan Lopez, the ex-fiancé of one of the victims, later died in a shootout with other responding officers.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,853
    Glen Burnie
    shooting in emergency room

    Your ignorance doesn't mean it isn't happening.


    2019

    A gunman shot and killed an emergency physician, a pharmacy resident, and a police officer at Chicago's Mercy Hospital in November, leaving the emergency physicians there reeling from the experience. They cycled through every emotion imaginable, from fear to guilt, but they were able to glean some lessons from their harrowing experience.

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10126164/ 1993 May

    The shootings of three doctors in a Los Angeles emergency room, and the subsequent hostage taking by the alleged assailant, received extensive national publicity and reportedly has had an impact on ER security at many hospitals--in California and elsewhere. In Part I of this report, we'll present details on what happened and what transpired afterward in connection with the hospital, Los Angeles County-University of Southern California Medical Center, and other California hospitals. Part II of this report, in our next issue, will deal with the event's impact on hospitals elsewhere in the country.

    ------------------

    2 DEAD, 5 WOUNDED AFTER ER SHOOTING PATIENT DIES OF HEART ATTACK AS WOMAN KILLS ANOTHER BEFORE POLICE SHOOT HER​


    A woman fired gunshots in a hospital emergency room Monday night, killing another woman and wounding that woman's husband before she was shot by police, authorities said.

    Another woman who was being treated for a gunshot wound when the shootings erupted died of a heart attack.

    Police said the shootings stemmed from a domestic fight.

    According to John Mitchell, a spokesman for Chippenham Hospital, three people - a 50-year-old woman, a 26-year-old woman and a 3-year-old boy - arrived about 7:45 p.m. suffering from gunshot wounds. They were brought in by a husband and wife.

    Minutes later, Mitchell said, a 45-year-old woman came into the emergency room and began shooting.

    Both the husband and wife were shot, the wife fatally.

    The husband was in surgery, Mitchell said.

    The woman doing the shooting was in stable condition with wounds that were not life-threatening, Mitchell said.

    During the shootings, the 50-year-old woman suffered a heart attack and died, Mitchell said.

    The conditions of the younger woman and the boy who came in with gunshot wounds were not immediately known.

    Authorities were withholding the names of the victims.

    ---------------

    Jul 28, 2023

    This week, a visitor opened fire at Legacy Good Samaritan Medical Center in Portland, killing a security guard and injuring a nurse.

    Following increases in both aggression towards nurses and mass shootings, stakeholders are debating whether new tech or old solutions can make a difference.

    ---------------
    A shooting in a Virginia hospital on Dec. 22 ended with two people injured and one suspect charged, according to the Richmond Times-Dispatch.


    Police said a 27-year-old man, Rasheed Pope Jr., had a firearm during the intake process at Chippenham Hospital, an HCA Healthcare facility in Richmond, Va., on Dec. 22. Police on site at the hospital for an unrelated matter were notified of the shooting at 4:11 a.m., which occurred in the hospital's ER.


    Police said Mr. Pope self-presented at the hospital for a mental health evaluation and was entering a room and getting into a gown when, without warning, he began firing his weapon, according to a Dec. 22 police news conference made available from local CBS affiliate WTVR.


    The shooting injured a Chesterfield County police officer and a male patient who was in the hallway, police said. Police said the officer was treated for injuries and released; the patient's injuries were considered critical but not life-threatening. Police said the shooting was not accidental, with multiple shots fired.


    Police arrested Mr. Pope on the scene. He has been charged with attempted murder and use of a firearm in the commission of a felony.

    -------------------

    On November 19, 2018, a mass shooting took place at the Mercy Hospital and Medical Center in Chicago, Illinois. An attending physician at the hospital, a police officer, and a pharmacy resident were killed. The gunman, later identified as Juan Lopez, the ex-fiancé of one of the victims, later died in a shootout with other responding officers.
    Tell me where I said it wasn't happening?
    At least you made yourself feel good searching for these rare instances that never happened in Maryland, let alone any BWMC facility.
     

    BurkeM

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2014
    1,788
    Baltimore
    Tell me where I said it wasn't happening?
    At least you made yourself feel good searching for these rare instances that never happened in Maryland, let alone any BWMC facility.
    Your ignorance proves to be redoubled.

    Hospitals share data and take precautions based on the scientific evidence NATIONWIDE, they see no reason to wait for it to happen HERE.
     

    Threeband

    The M1 Does My Talking
    Dec 30, 2006
    25,427
    Carroll County
    In this area (MoCo) the security guards are unarmed. However, the hospitals I go to have at least 1 or 2 local PD officers around in the ED.

    Johns Hopkins Emergency Department has metal detectors staffed by both unarmed Hopkins security and an armed Baltimore City cop at the entrance. That setup was new two years ago, when it took me by surprise and forced me to take my knife back to my car.

    They've had an armed City cop hanging out in the Emergency Department waiting area for years before that.

    Everywhere else, however, Hopkins security is unarmed.

    Carroll Hospital just installed bulletproof plexiglass barriers around the check-in area of their Emergency Department. It's very annoying because it makes it very hard to talk to the person staffing the check-in.

    Bending down and trying to speak through the little opening in the plexiglass, I said, "This is very annoying. I'm guessing their was some kind of 'incident,'" to which she only answered, "Yes."

    Does anyone know what happened there?

    All of their security is unarmed. I usually drop my knife to the bottom of my pocket when I go there.
     

    Lafayette

    Not that kind of doctor
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2021
    522
    Maryland
    Again, still rare instances.
    Definitely rare. This happened in the parking lot outside the emergency department at BWMC.


    That kind of incident makes me want to carry MORE inside of a hospital, not less. This security “upgrade” will be more theater than actually making it safer at the hospital.
     

    Boats

    Broken Member
    Mar 13, 2012
    4,152
    Howeird County
    I work at BWMC in the ER. This is a good thing.

    From my point of view, if someone is more concerned about their right to carry than getting medical treatment, then they most likely aren't having an emergency and don't need to be at the ER anyway. See your primary care if your priority is being able to carry your pistol.

    The amount of techs, nurses and doctors who have been assaulted, maimed and killed by feral humans is unacceptable. Furthermore, as a genera rule, if hospital staff try to defend ourselves even while unarmed, we are usually suspended or even fired. The perpetrator (usually a psych patient but not always) is very rarely charged because "they aren't in the right frame of mind".

    I have a friend, an ER nurse, who has to live with a 6" scar on his head after he got put through a plate glass door. Patient who did it got a misdemeanor assault charge and leniency due to a history of psych issues. I know female nurses who have been knocked out cold and lost teeth. I personally have been punched, kicked, spit on in my eyes, and had knives and guns pulled on me at work. A security guard I know got fired after injuring a patient when going "hands on" after the patient assaulted a nurse.

    Finally, you have the hospitals themselves who have determined that it is cheaper to pay out a workers comp claim for an employee than a personal injury or wrongful death suit from a patient. Most attorneys aren't even willing to go up against Hopkins or University for the workers comp claims.
     
    Last edited:

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,853
    Glen Burnie
    Definitely rare. This happened in the parking lot outside the emergency department at BWMC.


    That kind of incident makes me want to carry MORE inside of a hospital, not less. This security “upgrade” will be more theater than actually making it safer at the hospital.
    Iirc this was an incident that spilled over from the area and not a direct action to the hospital?

    Regardless, this stupid system will prevent nothing.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,853
    Glen Burnie
    Airplane Hijackings are rare things ( even back in their hey day . were rare as a % ) . , and look at preventative measures in US and world wide .
    They were pretty common for what they were. "Take me to Cuba".
    They weren't acts of terrorism for catastrophic results.
    And they are still the preferred act simply because for it's shock value and government response.
    You can't compare hi jacking to a specific revenge act of an ex busting into an ER wanting to hurt his spouse.

    Hospitals don't want to provide proper security and response.
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,788
    Columbia
    All too often.

    Shooters have been known to follow an ambulance into the ER to finish off a victim who survived the street shooting.

    Also Domestic Violence- abusers have hunted down a victim to eliminate the 'threat.'

    When has it happened in MD?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    Boats

    Broken Member
    Mar 13, 2012
    4,152
    Howeird County
    Hospitals don't want to provide proper security and response.

    It is much more complicated than that.

    Hospitals and their staff exist to help people. Shooting someone does not help them (it may help the shooter, or someone else, or society, but never the person being shot).

    When someone goes to a hospital for help (either voluntarily or involuntarily) and ends up shot, maimed, or dead it makes the news. Which brings bad publicity on the hospital.

    Proper security and response to incidents is reactive and makes the news. Screening for weapons is proactive and may prevent an incident. And the last thing a hospital wants is a "good samaritan" patient popping another patient who is assaulting staff. Best case, the assaulter gets shot. Worst case, the bullet hits another patient, or causes another patient to have a heart attack, or hits an oxygen line in the wall. In any of those cases the hospital is getting sued.

    Or a patient family member, upset because their loved one isn't getting the care they think they deserve, pulling a gun.

    Even historically, at military hospitals in a war zone, weapons are checked before entry. You'll be ok not being armed in an ER in America.

    Again, if being armed is your highest priority, then you aren't having an emergency. If being armed is your highest priority, then you probably arent as concerned about your loved one as you think you are.
     
    Last edited:

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,853
    Glen Burnie
    It is much more complicated than that.

    Hospitals and their staff exist to help people. Shooting someone does not help them (it may help the shooter, or someone else, or society, but never the person being shot).

    When someone goes to a hospital for help (either voluntarily or involuntarily) and ends up shot, maimed, or dead it makes the news. Which brings bad publicity on the hospital.

    Proper security and response to incidents is reactive and makes the news. Screening for weapons is proactive and may prevent an incident. And the last thing a hospital wants is a "good samaritan" patient popping another patient who is assaulting staff. Or a patient family member, upset because their loved one isn't getting the care they think they deserve, pulling a gun.

    Even historically, at military hospitals in a war zone, weapons are checked before entry.

    Again, if being armed is your highest priority, then you aren't having an emergency. If being armed is your highest priority, then you probably arent as concerned about your loved one as you think you are.
    I'm not for patients taking pistols into a place of healing. I've always said that about the doctor office threads too.
    You have issues if you get a ruptured appendix and the first thing you think of is getting your pistol to go to the ER with you.
     

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