Quick Question on Saiga Rifles

[Scott7891]

However, you would likely be making a banned Assault Long Gun if all you did was leave it in a sporter config and make is accept standard mags. It wouldn't be importable in that configuration.

It would be illegal since the ability to take greater than 10 rounds are illegal on imported rifles. That in turn would make it a banned Maryland gun if it could take more.

The Arsenal SA-93 they mentioned on the list is now considered a banned weapon because the import standards changed two years after the bulletin was written. It is banned not only by name but also because it can take standard magazines greater than 10 rounds.

 

[asdaven]

A saiga in it's original state is not a bad gun by any means.

Had a .308 I wished I'd kept, that thing was a tack driver. Changed everything I thought I knew about AKs. Until that point I thought that when people said they were 'accurate enough' that it meant minute of man at 100 yards.

More like minute of fist.

A SMALL fist if I was having a good day

Never underestimate a AK. Any rifle platform can be accurate. The first AKs built in Russia were milled much like the SKS. Most military AKs out there that shoot inaccurately are stamped AKs with poor build quality. Even then, I've seen stamped AKs that are pretty damn accurate. I have a Romanian RPK and it ll easily do fist size groups or smaller at 100 yards. RPK recievers use thicker sheet metal though and it has a longer heavier barrel. I wanted a rifle in the AK platform but didint want the normal short thin barrel of the AK. I wanted a long gun/AK sniper without going 7.62x54r....RPK or a VEPR was the ticket. Really its when you go full auto on a AK is when they get notoriously inaccurate. Part of that is poor quality barrels, the out of control handling of the gun, and loose reciever. Semi auto you can hit stuff. But really with anything full auto, three round burst is the way to go even mounted heavy machine guns. Surprised they didint make an AK varient with a 3 round burst option like the M16. Add a trained shooter behind it and they are very decent weapons. Hell, I think our special forces use AKs on some missions.

 

[armed ferret]

The first AKs built in Russia were milled much like the SKS.

No, the first AKs built in Russia were stamped, and then they went to a milled receiver for mass production, and then back to stamped when milled was too slow/wasteful/expensive.

 

[Forest]

I can't believe everyone keeps missing the big elephant in the room to determine if it is banned or not and that is if it is importable in its factory condition.

The MSP bulletin states this caveat that everyone overlooks. If the rifle is importable from overseas like the Saiga and it stays in its factory condition then it is just a normal rifle.

Remember we have had an import AWB since '89 that was further restricted in '98.

Scott, that is some very interesting information - Thank You!

 

[FoxFirearms]

Short & simple - Siaga's are copy's of AKs and not MD legal.

 

[aquaman]

Short & simple - Siaga's are copy's of AKs and not MD legal.

If that is true then all Ar-15 HBAR's must be banned and all Gas Piston AR's must be banned.

The Saiga is not a copy of the ak-47, AKM or 'automat kalashnikov' which is a catch all for all rifles starting with the AK prefix. The 100 series use a different bolt and carrier that are not interchangeable. The saiga uses different magazines and a FCG in a completely different spot than the AKM.

If we are going to concede this then we might as well give up now and accept that MD has stricter rifle regulations than NJ, CA,HI, Germany (most of the EU for that matter) and Russia.

 

[Forest]

I can't believe everyone keeps missing the big elephant in the room to determine if it is banned or not and that is if it is importable in its factory condition.

The MSP bulletin states this caveat that everyone overlooks. If the rifle is importable from overseas like the Saiga and it stays in its factory condition then it is just a normal rifle.

Remember we have had an import AWB since '89 that was further restricted in '98.

Scotty, do you have a link to that bulletin?

Thanks!

 

[Scott7891]

Scotty, do you have a link to that bulletin?

Thanks!

Here it is.

Page 3 in the first paragraph beneath where the last regulated (now banned) firearm entry is.

Maryland goes by the federal import law which is an AWB to define what one is.

 

[md123]

Bump. Hope this is still on the table.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4l2-nXO27r4

 

[armed ferret]

I'd prefer the x54r vepr, since it's way cheaper to shoot.

 

[Forest]

Here it is.

Page 3 in the first paragraph beneath where the last regulated (now banned) firearm entry is.

Maryland goes by the federal import law which is an AWB to define what one is.

You're the man Scott!!

 

[Scott7891]

You're the man Scott!!

You are welcome.

A lot of the people of the gun know about the '34, '68, '86, and '94 bans but very little if any knows about the '98 ban.

The '98 ban is what really screwed up the imports and is why we can't even get any cool one's anymore since the list mostly goes by names and also limits us to 10 rounds. Even the '89 and '94 bans were not as harsh as the less-well known '98 ban.

The '98 ban is why one can't get any more SAR's, Maadi's, Hakim's, FAL's, G3's, and a whole slew of others imported.

 

[jimbobborg]

Either way, I just priced some new Saigas, they're still going for over $500 a pop.

 

[rauler]

Short & simple - Siaga's are copy's of AKs and not MD legal.

Unfortunately that's how the powers that be see it. I would say that the Saiga is a derivative of the AK, not a copy. The 7.62x39 version Saiga is unable to accept standard AK-47 magazines; the Saiga's receiver lacks a bullet guide, the bullet guide is specifically built on the lip of the Saiga magazine; some model Saigas have a bolt hold open button; most versions of the rifle lack a pistol grip and don't have a threaded front sight block; the trigger and trigger guard are placed farther back on the receiver than on a typical AK series rifle, and a transfer bar type system is used to release the hammer. This information is easily found on the web, I found this on wikipedia. A couple of the differences are not definitive (trigger/trigger guard, bolt hold open button) but I would say that the other ones are.

I know I'm preaching to the choir and it doesn't matter what I think in this case but local gun shops should be able to sell them, even with the new draconian laws.