Kolbe v O'Malley Motion For Summary Judgement Filed 17 March 2014

Kharn · Aug 12, 2014

I really liked the "assault weapons are closer in number to machine guns than handguns" (paraphrased) line, because several million ARs/AKs imported per year is comparable to 200,000 MGs registered with the ATF over the years (which would be approximately 4,000 per year from 1934 to 1986). I really doubt there are anywhere near a thousand handguns manufactured per black rifle made in a year.

At least we didn't wait 5 years for the ruling.

Jaybeez · Aug 12, 2014

teratos said:
I think she may have given us a gift.

She hasn't done her homework.

I also differ with her on self-defense in the home being "the core" of the 2A. While self-defense is a God-given Right, the true core of the 2A is to preserve Liberty. That means The People reserve the Right (and the power) to overthrow the government.

so I guess my next step is to start a campaign to document how many people in md possess an ar for self defense in the home.

trickg · Aug 12, 2014

I thought that this one was interesting.

In recent decades, gun ownership in the United States has become increasingly concentrated; fewer households own firearms, but those households owning guns own more of them. (See Webster Decl. 13–14; see also NSSF Rep., ECF No. 44-75, at 13 (indicating that the average owner of modern sporting rifles had 2.6 such weapons in 2010 and 3.1 such weapons in 2013).) Using NSSF’s figure that the average assault weapons owner has 3.1 such weapons, this means less than 1% of Americans own an assault weapon.

I mean, is that even close to being statistically accurate? Most of the people I know who have ARs only have one of them.

frogman68 said:
This "decision" will be affirmed by the 4th then SCOTUS will deny Cert . There won't be a split so 281 is now going to stand . So glad the decision was made to bring this to court .

I see where he's going with this, and as it now sits, with the way this was worded, we now have a legal judgment in the United States that declares that ARs and mags holding more than 10 rounds are not protected by the 2nd Amendment. We have no choice but to push this forward, so let's say it goes all the way to the SCOTUS and we lose there, it paves the way for any state in the United States to ban ARs, and opens the door to another Federal gun ban.

Not_an_outlaw · Aug 12, 2014

trickg said:
I'm sitting here reading through this tripe and I'm disgusted by how willing she was to accept Koper and Webster at face value, but that everything presented by the plaintiffs was held to the highest level of scrutiny. This thing just drips with prejudicial bias.

Ditto. That was my first take after reading this.

jonnyl · Aug 12, 2014

I know that the "common use" terminology came from the Heller ruling, but it seems that relying too much on that would allow future bans of new technology before they have a chance to develop into common use.

Would it not make sense to also plead that the core of self-defense implies "fighting" arms.

You may have a need to fight to protect yourself. Wouldn't it make logical sense then to look not just at what other citizens have "in common use", but also what the police respond with to a call.

30 years ago if you called the police they showed up with a revolver and a shotgun. Today they come with a pistol with a >10 round magazine and and AR15 with 30 round mags.

Do they ever leave the AR15's in the trunk because there's only one bad guy barricaded in the house? No. Do they ever say "the perp only has a knife, so just grab the 10 round mag"? No.

Citizens face exactly the same threats as the police, and usually first and alone. Suggesting they should have less effective firearms is outrageous.

"Common use" seems to me to be similar to the "in the home" comments in Heller. Meaning that the DC law being overturned was so extreme as to be ridiculous. "We don't know where the line is on the 2A, but it most definitely applies in your house" and "arguing that handguns aren't appropriate for self defense is crazy because that's what most people use" seem similar to me.

This doesn't even take into account if the citizens ever needed to fight tyranny or a foreign threat. Also, I used the term "perp" like on tv

Not_an_outlaw · Aug 12, 2014

If you parse out this case, they could take about any firearm. Just need someone in Law Enforcement to ask!

Not_an_outlaw · Aug 12, 2014

To me, common use means the type of "technology." So, general firearms are in "common use" regardless of their differences. A heat seeking plasma missile with DNA recognition algorithm to me would fit the term "not common use!"

awptickes · Aug 12, 2014

Well, color me surprised.

But then again, look at her bio. I'm not surprised after reading that.

EL1227 · Aug 12, 2014

Probably mentioned before, but ...

teratos said:
I think she may have given us a gift.

She hasn't done her homework.

I also differ with her on self-defense in the home being "the core" of the 2A. While self-defense is a God-given Right, the true core of the 2A is to preserve Liberty. That means The People reserve the Right (and the power) to overthrow the government.

She was nominated to the United States Court for the District of Maryland by then President Bill Clinton on May 4, 1995. Clinton's AWB was signed shortly before on September 13, 1994 and was sunsetted on that date in 2004. Blake is preserving Slick Willie's 'legacy' by returning the favor. Just because she wears a robe doesn't mean that she didn't succumb to his 'charms' ... or an offer she couldn't refuse. :innocent0

danb · Aug 12, 2014

I'm shocked!

oh, wait, no I'm not. On to round 2.

fabsroman · Aug 12, 2014

Jaybeez said:
so I guess my next step is to start a campaign to document how many people in md possess an ar for self defense in the home.

You name it, I have it for self defense. While handguns are nice and handy, they are not the best weapon for self defense, whether it is in the home or outside the home. Use the handgun to fight your way to the long gun. If my wife and I can make it to the safe, I will be grabbing an AR and she will grab a shotgun. Working on getting a Benelli M4, but the SBE will have to suffice for now.

Anybody see the pics of the people in St. Louis outside the tattoo parlor defending it? What were they using? ARs. Didn't see many of them with handguns.

The problem with our case at this level, is that not enough evidence was gathered from manufacturers, etc. of the number of AR-15s sold in the US. Then, not just ARs, but all "assault weapons" in general. I believe the State made the argument that even using Plaintiff's numbers, it would amount to less than 1% of something (maybe total regulated weapon sales). Well, my question is, since the Form 77r was put in place, how many of them were for long guns? That is the true number of Assault Long guns sold during that time frame, discounting AR-10s and the like that are not on the "Assault Weapons" list and were never regulated.

I have so much to write about this matter, way too much to do on this case to get up to speed, way too much paying work at the moment, and way too little sleep.

JoeRinMD · Aug 12, 2014

trickg said:
I'm sitting here reading through this tripe and I'm disgusted by how willing she was to accept Koper and Webster at face value, but that everything presented by the plaintiffs was held to the highest level of scrutiny. This thing just drips with prejudicial bias.

I just gave it a quick scan and had the exact same response. She just accepted all of their arguments without any critical analysis of her own.

Ugggg...frustrating!

JoeR

clandestine · Aug 12, 2014

Agreed. I took one look at her bio and knew exactly how this round would go. Yes a LOOK means something.

QuebecoisWolf · Aug 12, 2014

Clinton appointee

Our only hope was that she'd strike down SB 281 on the grounds that it didn't ban nearly enough... and I shudder to think of what the MD state legislature would do with that mandate in 2015.

CrazySanMan · Aug 12, 2014

A sad day for Maryland. Today I'm closing on my house in Colorado, but I feel your pain.

danb · Aug 12, 2014

Properly reasoned, a complete ban on anything should not survive any level of scrutiny.

PHRFcrewman · Aug 12, 2014

Hey, I just purchased my first handgun. (Can take possession of it tomorrow.

)
If purchasing an AR lower or complete rifle will support the cause, I'll have a nice chat with my LGS.
I would think all our firearms are basically for protection of self, home, and country?

Patrick · Aug 12, 2014

JoeRinMD said:
I just gave it a quick scan and had the exact same response. She just accepted all of their arguments without any critical analysis of her own.

Ugggg...frustrating!

JoeR

Difference between this case and others: we got stuff into the record that others did not. It's there and available for further review.

Norton · Aug 12, 2014

threads merged

foxmanb · Aug 12, 2014

What a load of crap. What part of "...shall not be infringed" do they not understand?!

Kolbe v O'Malley Motion For Summary Judgement Filed 17 March 2014

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