selling AR out of state?

Gordon · Mar 10, 2016

Any guide lines on selling an AR out of state,PA or VA? Would it be same as long gun sale? Thanks

jimbobborg · Mar 10, 2016

Meet your buyer at an FFL in his state. Tell them you're doing a transfer. You give said rifle to the dealer, he does the paper work, then as the buyer do more paper work, every body pays up, then everyone walks away. One caveat. Call the dealer and tell them what you want to do. Some dealers here won't do it.

RoadDawg · Mar 11, 2016

Gordon said:
Any guide lines on selling an AR out of state,PA or VA? Would it be same as long gun sale? Thanks

Federal laws apply to sales across state lines...

FFL IS REQUIRED...
The sale can take place via a in state or out of state FFL.
You may choose a Md. FFL or a FFL in the state of the buyers residence.

Face to face sales are to same state residents only.

Regulated guns/hand guns require 2 FFLs, (a FFL from BOTH STATES) to complete the transfer.

Hawkeye · Mar 11, 2016

RoadDawg said:
Regulated guns/hand guns require 2 FFLs, (a FFL from BOTH STATES) to complete the transfer.

"Regulated" guns is a Maryland only thing.

Federally, it is only handguns that you need worry about, and they do NOT require an FFL on both ends - only in the state of residence of the purchaser. You, as a seller, can ship or deliver the handgun to an FFL (if they are willing to receive a gun from a non-FFL) in the state of residence of the purchaser, and they can handle the transfer.

Pinecone · Mar 11, 2016

RoadDawg said:
Federal laws apply to sales across state lines...

FFL IS REQUIRED...
The sale can take place via a in state or out of state FFL.
You may choose a Md. FFL or a FFL in the state of the buyers residence.

Face to face sales are to same state residents only.

No, if it is a currently banned long gun, the transfer MUST occur at an FFL OUTSIDE of MD.

Federal law requires the transaction to be legal both in the state it occurs AND the state of residence of the buyer.

So an MD FFL cannot transfer a banned firearm to anyone other than another FFL.

RoadDawg said:
Regulated guns/hand guns require 2 FFLs, (a FFL from BOTH STATES) to complete the transfer.

Not required. If the out of state FFL will accept the firearm from an individual (either in person or shipped), then only one FFL is needed.

And that is up to the receiving FFL to accept from an individual or not.

Pinecone · Mar 11, 2016

Hawkeye said:
"Regulated" guns is a Maryland only thing.

Federally, it is only handguns that you need worry about, and they do NOT require an FFL on both ends - only in the state of residence of the purchaser. You, as a seller, can ship or deliver the handgun to an FFL (if they are willing to receive a gun from a non-FFL) in the state of residence of the purchaser, and they can handle the transfer.

No, interstate transfers of long guns require an FFL to be involved. This is Federal law, GCA 86.

Handguns require the FFL to be in the state of residence of the buyer.

Long gun FFL can be in any state. As long as the transaction is legal in that state.

Hawkeye · Mar 11, 2016

Pinecone said:
No, interstate transfers of long guns require an FFL to be involved. This is Federal law, GCA 86.

Handguns require the FFL to be in the state of residence of the buyer.

Long gun FFL can be in any state. As long as the transaction is legal in that state.

Yeah, that was poor wording on my part. I was trying to get at the fact that "regulated firearms" is a Maryland only term and there are no special restrictions on the sales of certain long guns as opposed to other ones outside of Maryland.

RoadDawg · Mar 11, 2016

Pinecone said:
RoadDawg said:

Federal laws apply to sales across state lines...

FFL IS REQUIRED...
The sale can take place via a in state or out of state FFL.
You may choose a Md. FFL or a FFL in the state of the buyers residence.

Face to face sales are to same state residents only.

Click to expand...

Regulated guns/hand guns require 2 FFLs, (a FFL from BOTH STATES) to complete the transfer.No, if it is a currently banned long gun, the transfer MUST occur at an FFL OUTSIDE of MD.

Federal law requires the transaction to be legal both in the state it occurs AND the state of residence of the buyer.

So an MD FFL cannot transfer a banned firearm to anyone other than another FFL.

Not required. If the out of state FFL will accept the firearm from an individual (either in person or shipped), then only one FFL is needed.

And that is up to the receiving FFL to accept from an individual or not.

If you wish to disagree with me on something... Please pick something I actually said in the post that you disagree with.

I did not mention "banned guns" in that post. My comments were only about those guns which would be legal for Maryland residents to purchase and bring into the state.

trickg · Mar 11, 2016

While this question might be a bit out of left field for what this thread is talking about, I'm curious to know whether swapping a barrel out in an AR would affect its status. For instance, HBARs are not banned or regulated, so could a person take an AR, swap in a heavy barrel, thus making it an HBAR, and change the legal status of the firearm?

Blah! This thread and subject remind me of the following quote from "Atlas Shrugged":

"The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws."

ARs and the laws governing them here in Maryland have become so polluted and convoluted, that it's difficult to find a definitive answer to just what is or is not legal or illegal. I know that in my case, if all of these nonsense bills that have been proposed are passed into law, it will effectively paralyze my endeavors as a firearms enthusiast for the remainder of the time I live in this state before I can get the hell out to somewhere else. I don't want to take the chance of inadvertently running afoul of something, getting smacked with a mandatory minimum sentence, and then be prohibited for life. It seems extreme, but stranger things have happened.

Hawkeye · Mar 11, 2016

trickg said:
While this question might be a bit out of left field for what this thread is talking about, I'm curious to know whether swapping a barrel out in an AR would affect its status. For instance, HBARs are not banned or regulated, so could a person take an AR, swap in a heavy barrel, thus making it an HBAR, and change the legal status of the firearm?

In short, yes.

If you own a pre-2013 AR that is in a now-banned configuration (legal for you to keep, but not legal to sell in Maryland) you can swap an HBAR or an HBAR upper on to it and sell it as an HBAR rifle. That can be done face-to-face with another Maryland resident, of if selling to a resident of another state, it must go through an FFL.

If the buyer is a MD resident, they are NOT allowed to make it back into a now-banned configuration. It must stay an HBAR.

Gordon · Mar 11, 2016

Thanks for the help

jimbobborg · Mar 11, 2016

This may be a dumb question, but if you have an AR that is now banned, why would you sell it? Especially if you aren't planning on moving out of Maryland any time soon.

sxs · Mar 11, 2016

Hawkeye said:
In short, yes.

If you own a pre-2013 AR that is in a now-banned configuration (legal for you to keep, but not legal to sell in Maryland) you can swap an HBAR or an HBAR upper on to it and sell it as an HBAR rifle. That can be done face-to-face with another Maryland resident, of if selling to a resident of another state, it must go through an FFL.

If the buyer is a MD resident, they are NOT allowed to make it back into a now-banned configuration. It must stay an HBAR.

BUT The complicating factor is that you now have a previously regulated rifle registered in your own name. What you are suggesting, should be legal, but could possibly raise and issue with MSP.

Hawkeye · Mar 11, 2016

sxs said:
BUT The complicating factor is that you now have a previously regulated rifle registered in your own name. What you are suggesting, should be legal, but could possibly raise and issue with MSP.

Yeah, but that's no different than any other sale of any regulated firearm.

I've sold several regulated firearms (pre October '13) to people in other states. They got shipped to FFLs in those states, and MSP hasn't a clue. Even if you sell a regulated firearm (now just pistols) to another Marylander, MSP never "un-registers it" to you anyways.

trickg · Mar 11, 2016

jimbobborg said:
This may be a dumb question, but if you have an AR that is now banned, why would you sell it? Especially if you aren't planning on moving out of Maryland any time soon.

Simple - money.

My Dad always told my Mom (although I suspect that this was as much of an excuse for his somewhat expensive hobby of accumulating guns, reloading supplies, etc) that if something ever happened and they needed to do it, that the guns could be quickly turned over for cash. Of course that was a long time ago in a different state when things weren't quite what they are now where gun laws are concerned. Definitely before the mass-shooting madness started.

Pinecone · Mar 14, 2016

RoadDawg said:
If you wish to disagree with me on something... Please pick something I actually said in the post that you disagree with.

I did not mention "banned guns" in that post. My comments were only about those guns which would be legal for Maryland residents to purchase and bring into the state.

Hmm, maybe because the title of the thread is "selling AR out of state."

Pinecone · Mar 14, 2016

Heck, even if you sell a handgun IN MD, with a 77R, that handgun is listed in the MD database under your name.

They do not replace the name of the owner, they just list every person that they have completed paperwork on.

But this is why most on here recommend a bill of sale. MSP comes to ask you about X firearm, you say I sold it, and here is a copy of the bill of sale.

RoadDawg · Mar 14, 2016

Pinecone said:
Hmm, maybe because the title of the thread is "selling AR out of state."

Hmmm...

Maybe you should re-read my post that you quoted in you prior response...

Pay attention to the FIRST line...
Here it is for you again:

Federal laws apply to sales across state lines...

Pinecone · Mar 16, 2016

RoadDawg said:
Hmmm...

Maybe you should re-read my post that you quoted in you prior response...

Pay attention to the FIRST line...
Here it is for you again:

And according to Federal Law, STATE laws apply also, for the state of the transaction and the state of residence of the buyer.

Therefore an MD FFL cannot sell some firearms to an out of state resident.

And the reason this may apply is, THE THREAD IS ABOUT SELLING AN AR, which in most configurations is BANNED IN MD.

RoadDawg · Mar 16, 2016

Pinecone said:
And according to Federal Law, STATE laws apply also, for the state of the transaction and the state of residence of the buyer.

Therefore an MD FFL cannot sell some firearms to an out of state resident.

And the reason this may apply is, THE THREAD IS ABOUT SELLING AN AR, which in most configurations is BANNED IN MD.

Quote the law that states "...a Md. resident can not sell a non HBAR AR 15 rifle to an out of state resident through a FFL, where the out of state buyer is lawfully able to buy it."

GO AHEAD SHOW US. SINCE YOU WANT TO YELL... :sad20:

WTF?

selling AR out of state?

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