ATF Kickbacks Form 1

[boricuamaximus]

So the guys in WVa kicked back my form because on section 4H they want the full name of the trust.

Section 4H states:
"Additional Description (Include all numbers and other identifying data which will appear on the firearm)"

I put the normal stuff that's on the firearm like:
Ishvek/<whatever,
I placed the engraving that I was going to put on that form as well:
"XXXX trust <City> MD"

Their reason for kicking it back is that I have to have the full name of the trust on section 4H.

So does this mean that I have to engrave "xxxx Revocable Trust, City State"? I thought I could get away with XXXX. On my trust is says "this trust is also known as XXXX Trust"

Mailed out on Jan 21 just to get it kicked back today. I love how the 1986 laws keep us safe.

 

[Inigoes]

I've always used my full first, full middle, and full last name.

When I filled out the 5320.20, I was brain dead and used my middle initial. They politely guided me to the error to correct.

 

[crfakm4]

Mine got kicked back 2 years ago for the same thing. They want you to engrave whats on the form on the gun, no abbreviations.

 

[rico903]

Since I am about to submit a Form 4 I have a couple of questions. Is engraving your info on the firearm needed because you are manufacturing a classIII weapon or do all trusts require that?

 

[clandestine]

I use the full name and addy

Albrecht Trust
123 Anyplace Street
Glen Burnie, MD 21061

 

[boricuamaximus]

Mine got kicked back 2 years ago for the same thing. They want you to engrave whats on the form on the gun, no abbreviations.

I understand that but the name of the trust is "XXXX Revocable Trust"

On section 4H I wrote "XXXX Trust" what I am going to engrave on the gun. My trust states XXXX Revocable Trust also known as XXXX Trust.

 

[BenL]

I found out, after I had my trust drawn up, that you need to put the FULL name of the trust on the gun/lower. Of course, my Lawyer decided to call my trust "The Benjamin XXXXX XXXXXXXXX Revocable Trust."

It's a freakin' paragraph.

 

[teratos]

I use the full name and addy

Albrecht Trust
123 Anyplace Street
Glen Burnie, MD 21061

Do you have to put the street? I thought it was just the name of the trust and the town.

Teratos Trust
Bel Air, MD

I am going to form 1 a lower in the near future, so just curious.

 

[canuck]

The actual name of the trust and city and state goes on firearm.

I got a new trust with a much shorter name. Magwell fills up fast on an AR with the standard trust names.

 

[BenL]

The actual name of the trust and city and state goes on firearm.

I got a new trust with a much shorter name. Magwell fills up fast on an AR with the standard trust names.

Can you fit three lines on a lower?

Example:


The Benjamin XXXXX
XXXXXXXXX Revocable Trust
Baltimore, MD​

Also, a little off topic, but can you write "multi" for caliber, or does it have to be mated to a single upper?

 

[clandestine]

Do you have to put the street? I thought it was just the name of the trust and the town.

Teratos Trust
Bel Air, MD

I am going to form 1 a lower in the near future, so just curious.

The way I do them is on the BATFE Form 1 (In part 3b) I put the following:

Doe Trust
123 Anyplace Street
Glen Burnie, MD 21061

On the Firearm (Engraved) and in on Section (h) of the Form 1 I put:

Doe Trust, Glen Burnie, MD

Can you fit three lines on a lower?

Example:


The Benjamin XXXXX
XXXXXXXXX Revocable Trust
Baltimore, MD​

Also, a little off topic, but can you write "multi" for caliber, or does it have to be mated to a single upper?

Yes 3 lines will fit on most guns with the approved font size.

BATFE no longer accepts Multi for the Caliber, you must be specific for the primary configuration. If you gun is engraved Multi then when you get it engraved with the primary caliber the weapon is configured for, they will not accept "Multi".

If you wish to use additional calibers you can submit a letter after your Form 1 is approved listing your intent to use other calibers. Just list the calibers and then you keep that letter with your Form 1. Also if you have space on line (h) you can list the other calibers you wish to use, but youll have to engrave the calibers (Each caliber) if you list it there.

 

[teratos]

The way I do them is on the BATFE Form 1 (In part 3b) I put the following:

Doe Trust
123 Anyplace Street
Glen Burnie, MD 21061

On the Firearm (Engraved) and in on Section (h) of the Form 1 I put:

Doe Trust, Glen Burnie, MD

Thanks for the info.....

 

[Kingjamez]

If you wish to use additional calibers you can submit a letter after your Form 1 is approved listing your intent to use other calibers. Just list the calibers and then you keep that letter with your Form 1. Also if you have space on line (h) you can list the other calibers you wish to use, but youll have to engrave the calibers (Each caliber) if you list it there.

I've never seen any guidance from the BATFE on the need to submit anything in order to use other calibers, or the need to engrave multiple calibers. I have seen guidance that says the lower should always have an upper of the approved caliber, but that's it as far as I know.

-Jim

 

[clandestine]

I've never seen any guidance from the BATFE on the need to submit anything in order to use other calibers, or the need to engrave multiple calibers. I have seen guidance that says the lower should always have an upper of the approved caliber, but that's it as far as I know.

-Jim

I think my post wasnt clear. You are correct there is no need to engrave the additional calibers, BUT if you list additional caliber on line (h) you do have to engrave it because your saying the gun has those markings when you fill that in there.

Many AR lowers are now being stamped "Multi", this is a problem because BATFE wants a specific caliber, so if I have a Spikes AR15 Lower and it says "Multi" as caliber, and I primarily use it as a 5.56 I was told that should be engraved in addition to the SBR manufacturers name on the Form 1.

The additional letter listing multiple calibers was a recomendaton from my NFA trust Attorney (GunTrustlawyer.com.....I call him alot). its unlikely that its needed, but the last thing I want is to be blasting at a range with a registered 5.56 SBR AR and hapen to have a 9mm kit on it and its not listed. I cover all my bases with my C3 weapons. i even fillout 5320.20 forms when I take my suppressors out of state even though its not required.

 

[antco]

This weekend I filled out and mailed a Form 1. I failed to put City/State after the name of my trust on box 3b. I can expect this application to be rejected, can't I? This was an oversight on my part that I failed to realize until a day later, when the ATF already had it.

 

[Kingjamez]

I think my post wasnt clear. You are correct there is no need to engrave the additional calibers, BUT if you list additional caliber on line (h) you do have to engrave it because your saying the gun has those markings when you fill that in there.

Many AR lowers are now being stamped "Multi", this is a problem because BATFE wants a specific caliber, so if I have a Spikes AR15 Lower and it says "Multi" as caliber, and I primarily use it as a 5.56 I was told that should be engraved in addition to the SBR manufacturers name on the Form 1.

The additional letter listing multiple calibers was a recomendaton from my NFA trust Attorney (GunTrustlawyer.com.....I call him alot). its unlikely that its needed, but the last thing I want is to be blasting at a range with a registered 5.56 SBR AR and hapen to have a 9mm kit on it and its not listed. I cover all my bases with my C3 weapons. i even fillout 5320.20 forms when I take my suppressors out of state even though its not required.

That makes perfect sense. Thanks for the clarification.

-Jim

 

[BenL]

Many AR lowers are now being stamped "Multi", this is a problem because BATFE wants a specific caliber, so if I have a Spikes AR15 Lower and it says "Multi" as caliber, and I primarily use it as a 5.56 I was told that should be engraved in addition to the SBR manufacturers name on the Form 1.

Ahhhh... so if my lower is marked "5.56mm" but I'm building a .300BLK, I have mark the lower with .300BLK?

 

[clandestine]

Ahhhh... so if my lower is marked "5.56mm" but I'm building a .300BLK, I have mark the lower with .300BLK?

Im just saying thats what my attorney said and I do it IF its the weapons primary config. It may not be written in law but he said BATFE prefers it this way. Its not a hassle since I have to get engraving done anyway.

 

[BenL]

Im just saying thats what my attorney said and I do it IF its the weapons primary config. It may not be written in law but he said BATFE prefers it this way. Its not a hassle since I have to get engraving done anyway.

+1

If it's got to go in, anyway...

Do you know what the required font size is?

 

[canuck]

Can you fit three lines on a lower?

Example:


The Benjamin XXXXX
XXXXXXXXX Revocable Trust
Baltimore, MD​

Also, a little off topic, but can you write "multi" for caliber, or does it have to be mated to a single upper?

14 characters per line fits. My ARs are done on the front of the magwell. Orion arms did them.