CA4 Issues Stay, Expedites Appeal

[damionkarp]

Today I voted for Romney, said no to questions 6 and 7. Voted for Nancy Jacob and Dan Bongino. Although this sticker is meant for kids, I changed the context of the sticker to mean with Romney we have a future.

 

[krucam]

Loaded magazines in transport, R's/D's/I's, NYC Courts, Copyright issues, Vote.....what was this thread about, again?

 

[damionkarp]

Loaded magazines in transport, R's/D's/I's, NYC Courts, Copyright issues, Vote.....what was this thread about, again?

No news from the CA4?

 

[MJD438]

No news from the CA4?

2 more weeks...

 

[damionkarp]

Loaded magazines in transport, R's/D's/I's, NYC Courts, Copyright issues, Vote.....what was this thread about, again?

Relax, you can vote for Obama Tuesday.

 

[dblas]

Loaded magazines in transport, R's/D's/I's, NYC Courts, Copyright issues, Vote.....what was this thread about, again?

All we need are pics of babes with guns and it will be a complete thread...

 

[southern71]

All we need are pics of babes with guns and it will be a complete thread...

+infinity

 

[csanc123]

Relax, you can vote for Obama Tuesday.

How about keeping it on topic and not being a douchbag??

 

[clandestine]

How about keeping it on topic and not being a douchbag??

Im pretty sure a few people involved in these MD CCW threads voted for Obama last time. They admitted it here.

If we lose this case it can be attributed to the OBAMA appointees. Elections have consequences.

 

[krucam]

Im pretty sure a few people involved in these MD CCW threads voted for Obama last time. They admitted it here.

If we lose this case it can be attributed to the OBAMA appointees. Elections have consequences.

King was a Clinton appointee and by far our biggest challenge at the argument. Davis and Diaz showed the most promise and are Obama appointees.

 

[clandestine]

King was a Clinton appointee and by far our biggest challenge at the argument. Davis and Diaz showed the most promise and are Obama appointees.

Sorry, I dont have rose colored glasses on. I listened to the Audio and unless the Judges Physical Mannerisms showed contrary to the Audio, there was nothing positive about that hearing for the 2A side.

Elections have consequences.

 

[dlmcbm]

All we need are pics of babes with guns and it will be a complete thread...

Have to have the cute little kitty also.

 

[CypherPunk]

The republican party has pissed me off, but I'm doing the same. Republicans in Maryland are mostly just conservative Democrats. Need to break the stranglehold the party has on this state.

Politicians and diapers should be changed regularly... and often for the same reason.

 

[damionkarp]

I think you're reading too much into Maryland giving permission to transport. Maryland doesn't have to recognize the right to allow you to take a gun to the range. They're just allowing you to do something because they're so nice. Similar to the fact that my daughter doesn't have a right to watch TV in my house just because within our guidelines we allow her to watch TV sometimes. Her TV watching is completely at my whim and I can revoke at any time.

That's basically Maryland's position. They're then further saying "even if it does exist outside the home, we're in compliance because folks can carry a shotgun for self defense"

which as we all know is BS...

I don't think I'm reading too much. I'm applying the law to the constitution. Maryland passed a law saying you can transport your gun to the range or gunsmith. By saying this they recognize the right extends beyond the home. Imagine if Maryland said you can own a gun for defense in the home, but you can never take the gun outside the home. Ok, how do I get the gun from the place of purchase to my home. If it needs repair, how do I get it to a gunsmith. I don't manufacture guns in my home, nor do I repair them in my home. Therefore, the right exists outside the home.

Maryland is saying you can transport the gun outside the home, but you can't use the gun for protection outside the home unless we permit you to under our strict pleasure. ( buzzer..,) wrong! Under the 14thA I have the same right to self defense as those who Maryland permits to carry outside the home. I for one am glad Maryland now has to answer for this and I can't see us common folk losing at any level of the courts now thanks to SAF, Gura, and Wollard.

 

[jonnyl]

I don't think I'm reading too much. I'm applying the law to the constitution. Maryland passed a law saying you can transport your gun to the range or gunsmith. By saying this they recognize the right extends beyond the home. Imagine if Maryland said you can own a gun for defense in the home, but you can never take the gun outside the home. Ok, how do I get the gun from the place of purchase to my home. If it needs repair, how do I get it to a gunsmith. I don't manufacture guns in my home, nor do I repair them in my home. Therefore, the right exists outside the home.

Maryland is saying you can transport the gun outside the home, but you can't use the gun for protection outside the home unless we permit you to under our strict pleasure. ( buzzer..,) wrong! Under the 14thA I have the same right to self defense as those who Maryland permits to carry outside the home. I for one am glad Maryland now has to answer for this and I can't see us common folk losing at any level of the courts now thanks to SAF, Gura, and Wollard.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that the 2nd amendment seems pretty straight forward and easy to interpret. But Maryland does not recognize that the 2A exists outside the home. They are giving us permission to transport. It's a privilege they're bestowing on us and we should consider ourselves lucky (in their eyes).

If they didn't allow transport, I think it would be practically and open and shut constitutional case. If that happened, then MD would be forced to recognize that they MUST allow transport. But at this time that's not the case.

 

[uscoastiee]

All we can do now is wait and see. We have not lost, yet and we don't know what the court will say or how they will rule. We can thrash through the options after we have an opinion, which is months away in all likelihood. In the meantime, we should be looking forward to a ruling from the 7th Circuit in Moore/Shepard and from the 2nd Circuit in Kachalsky. Both of those cases will probably come down before Woollard and, if so, both will likely impact on what the CA4 does in our case. We are only in the early 3d quarter here and we are still leading.

Any idea of the judges who sat on the panels in the 7th and the 2nd, with regards to who appointed them and what their 2A views may be?

 

[esqappellate]

Any idea of the judges who sat on the panels in the 7th and the 2nd, with regards to who appointed them and what their 2A views may be?

I don't find the the name of the appointing president to be very useful as a predictor on this issue. But, we have a better indicator, the actual argument. I listened to the tapes of both arguments (they are on the National 2A forum). I expect a win in the 7th on whether the right exists at all outside the home (which is the only question presented). 2nd was an excellent argument on the NY carry statute and we may get a favorable result there, but that is a closer call. Those judges were better prepared and more disposed to us from the argument tape.

 

[mk10]

Any idea of the judges who sat on the panels in the 7th and the 2nd, with regards to who appointed them and what their 2A views may be?

CA7 - Moore/Shepard v. Madigan
Judge Richard Posner - Reagan
Judge Ann Claire Williams - Clinton
Judge Joel Flaum - Reagan


CA2 - Kachalsky v. Cacace
Judge Robert Katzmann - Clinton
Judge Richard Wesley - George W. Bush
Judge Gerald Lynch - Obama

 

[fightinbluhen51]

I don't find the the name of the appointing president to be very useful as a predictor on this issue. But, we have a better indicator, the actual argument. I listened to the tapes of both arguments (they are on the National 2A forum). I expect a win in the 7th on whether the right exists at all outside the home (which is the only question presented). 2nd was an excellent argument on the NY carry statute and we may get a favorable result there, but that is a closer call. Those judges were better prepared and more disposed to us from the argument tape.

I did mean to ask this of you the other day and that is did the expedited merits panel have any impact upon thale lack of perceived preparation?

 

[esqappellate]

I did mean to ask this of you the other day and that is did the expedited merits panel have any impact upon thale lack of perceived preparation?

Probably not a bit. They had plenty of time to get prepared. I mean, jeez, they had months and the briefs are not *that* large. It was quite the contrast with the 2nd Circuit panel which conducted a 90 minute argument (extraordinary!) and set the case for last on the docket that day for that very purpose. Pretty impressive. It is rather sad that the 4th Circuit panel was not up to that standard.