Concealed Carry

[Name Taken]

So then, what, in your opinion is an ***acceptable** alternative?

Just like every time you get in your car to go to work.

You realize you are putting a lot of faith in the thousand of other cars on the roads.

You realize as you CCW you are putting your faith in other people pending on the situation.

The reality is none of us will be involved in a fatal car accident. The other reality is none of us (shall issued or not) will likely pull a firearm in self defense.

But be aware...bad things can happen...and the police arent always going to see you as a good guy from a bad guy pending on the situation.

 

[Blaster229]

What a person or cop would do depends on their experience and training. I need to be vague regarding what I do and tactics so it's tough to explain. My better judgement should have told me to not enter into this post but here goes. If things break bad, I/we operate from a position of dominance requiring full compliance of everyone nearby/ in my space, call it what you want. It doesn't allow for interaction with unknown gun carriers. I am not going to change my thinking about other unknowns in this situation. That will get me and many others killed in my line of work. You resort back to your training.
My training does not have me seeing other unkown weapons as friendly. Sorry if you take it personal. But, why does that mean I disrespect the fight for 2A carry? I said several times that it doesn't. I love guns and I love freedom. To answer the OP, this Federal LEO is on the side of 2A rights.

 

[StantonCree]

So then, what, in your opinion is an ***acceptable** alternative?

Hate to be that guy but there is no accepted alternatives. You guys can debate this massive quandry till your red in the face, its a tough one. 1000 scenarios with 40k outcomes. While I sincerely understand the need/want for an answer every person is different. I got pistol whipped and didn't shoot the suspect but a guy with a crowbar motioned towards an officer and paid with his life (YouTube cop shoots man with crowbar . We are people and all going to act differently. Again I understand the need/want for an answer but unless put in that situation u never know.

Lets pray I get there after u did my job for me

 

[scrovak]

So your all jacked up on adreline and are in the fight for your life mode of fight or flight. You have just pulled your weapon and either fired or gained some compliance from the bad guy.

Everyone else in the mall is likely to start running/screaming/ducking etc. So let's assume there is A LOT going on.

And the police show up..."drop the gun" you dont hear it or it doesnt register as your mind is highly focused on the threat. "Drop the gun" again so this is the second order and you still might not hear it or it doesnt register. Then where are we?

Again you can "what if" any situation to make any out come you want...but let's just be aware of the reality of things.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I promise!

When adrenaline is pumping, aren't our senses generally enhanced a bit, ramped up, for more visual acuity, auditory perception, etc. in the fight-or-flight reaction?

Lastly, if I fired or gained compliance from the BG, wouldn't it then be time to lower the gun, while maintaining readiness, since either situation would presumably negate his threat to your life?

 

[scrovak]

The reality is none of us will be involved in a fatal car accident.

Well shit, time to cancel my insurance


I know what you meant, the reality is that none of us are likely to, but I still had to poke at ya!

 

[Forager]

What a person or cop would do depends on their experience and training. I need to be vague regarding what I do and tactics so it's tough to explain. My better judgement should have told me to not enter into this post but here goes. If things break bad, I/we operate from a position of dominance requiring full compliance of everyone nearby/ in my space, call it what you want. It doesn't allow for interaction with unknown gun carriers. I am not going to change my thinking about other unknowns in this situation. That will get me and many others killed in my line of work. You resort back to your training.
My training does not have me seeing other unkown weapons as friendly. Sorry if you take it personal. But, why does that mean I disrespect the fight for 2A carry? I said several times that it doesn't. I love guns and I love freedom. To answer the OP, this Federal LEO is on the side of 2A rights.

I've got no problem with that. If I ever get a chance to, I'd be honored to shake your hand and buy you a cup of coffee or a beer (depending upon time/place/circumstance).

I can wholeheartedly agree that you resort back to training. But for training, and my ability to carry a handgun in another jurisdiction (a RIGHT that is currently denied in the "Free State"), I'd not be here to post this.

 

[Name Taken]

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I promise!

When adrenaline is pumping, aren't our senses generally enhanced a bit, ramped up, for more visual acuity, auditory perception, etc. in the fight-or-flight reaction?

Lastly, if I fired or gained compliance from the BG, wouldn't it then be time to lower the gun, while maintaining readiness, since either situation would presumably negate his threat to your life?

It depends...if you've fired your weapon your hearing has likely shut down.

If you are focusing on the bad guy's hands as he might have a weapon next to him your hearing is probably taking a back seat to your eyesight.

That's the problem...short of going through these actual situations in a training enviroment it's impossible to tell how your body will react.

As for your last question...again it depends on what made up situation we are in. If you fire, hit bad guy, he drops guns, and falls down but the gun is still with in his reach do you feel safe? Are you moving forward to move the gun from his reach or going to try and gain an tactical advantage with cover/concealment? Are you going to freeze up and stand there is disbeleif at the situation?

 

[Safetech]

Not trying to be argumentative either.


I guess my point ,at this point, is that if we get "Shall Issue" and a lot more people begin to carry in this state, there should probably be some training available both for the carriers AND the police, to deal with those situations safely and consistently.

 

[Blaster229]

Not trying to be argumentative either.


I guess my point ,at this point, is that if we get "Shall Issue" and a lot more people begin to carry in this state, there should probably be some training available both for the carriers AND the police, to deal with those situations safely and consistently.

Well put.

 

[scrovak]

Well put.

Agreed. We wouldn't want every yahoo with a gun thinking he could run into a bank if it was being robbed, or roll up to a police stand-off to 'help'.

 

[matt.ruszala]

Folks. I have not finished reading this whole thread but I have to say everyone is entitled to an opposing view. However, let me interject with this. If you knew it was a requirement for citizens to carry concealed in this state, to go throught the same sort of training that police officers have to take, would you then feel more comfortable with a citizen with a weapon?

 

[matt.ruszala]

Tidewatcher!!! How eloquently put. Nice penmanship. I agree with your evaluation. I am 100% in favor of "shall carry" or whatever politcally correct manner in which it is presented to the legislators. I would caution anyone willing to take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm in public to seriously consider taking courses in tactical response. There are organizations that teach these important technical scenarios to civilians. You can bet your bottom dollar that if I had a permit and carry a weapon, I would be fully trained before I would attempt to draw in a public setting. If I were alone, in the dark, with a one on one situation. I would draw if my life depended on it without training. Howevern not in a crowded public setting. In which most cases the thug probably would not ecounter anyone.

 

[iobidder]

Folks. I have not finished reading this whole thread but I have to say everyone is entitled to an opposing view. However, let me interject with this. If you knew it was a requirement for citizens to carry concealed in this state, to go throught the same sort of training that police officers have to take, would you then feel more comfortable with a citizen with a weapon?

I do not think thats a realistic question. Civilians should meet certain requirements to carry and handle a handgun, sure, but to the extent of a Police Officer, not quite. There are Police Officers out there who have issues handling / shooting a weapon accurately or appropriately, believe it or not.

Last, I personally think that if you have a CCW, for your state (MD) you should qualify at least annually. But all in all, I think Maryland CCW issuance is a joke, too restrictive and I am all for 2A's here.

 

[Combloc]

Last time I talked to an LEO about it, he was against it. Made me mad.

Don't you just love it when someone carrying a pistol tries to explain that YOU shouldn't be allowed to carry one?

 

[esqappellate]

Folks. I have not finished reading this whole thread but I have to say everyone is entitled to an opposing view. However, let me interject with this. If you knew it was a requirement for citizens to carry concealed in this state, to go throught the same sort of training that police officers have to take, would you then feel more comfortable with a citizen with a weapon?

You bet! And I would do the training in a heart beat.

 

[cobra]

How do those states that already allow ccw trane their police and citizens?
Could'nt the same training/thought process be had here in MD if ccw were to happen?

As much as I support our 2nd ammentment as a right reguardless.
Due to the senarios mentioned. Some sort of training/schooling/education will be needed not only for ccw holders but fot law enforcment as well.

Face it years of state policy not allowing anyone but a leo to legally carry in this state will take training and education to over come this states mindstate that anyone with a gun is a bg.

Unless law enforcement along with the ccw holder understand the expected proceedures and laws. There will be conflicts.
Education,education.

 

[Boondock Saint]

Why more training required for folks after we go shall issue? I'm not at all suggesting more training is a bad thing, but if the present standard is working, why should more be required? Seems like a way for the state to make a permit harder and more expensive to attain.

But, one step at a time.

 

[cobra]

Just saying Maryland residents have for years been taught guns are bad.
It's going to take a lot of education of the public to teach them ccw is not a evil thing.
The sheeple of MD need to be made aware of the aditude that ordinary persons carrying guns are not a bad thing.
Concider the leo's whom have never had to deal with a public that under law are allowed to carry.
They have allways been trained, if someone has a gun, they are a bad guy.
It's a culture shock to this liberal state to finally regonize ones freedoms to ccw opposed to have a gun your a bad guy/crimina mentality.
The mindset that has taken years to instill on the population will take time to change

 

[e40bib]

First, do you have ANY anecdotal evidence of this being the case where concealed or open carry is common?

Second... So you'd prefer that the rest of us unwashed masses BE unsafe, so you can FEEL safe?

That is just what I was going to say. Has this ever happend in states that have CCW?

 

[swinokur]

How do those states that already allow ccw trane their police and citizens?
Could'nt the same training/thought process be had here in MD if ccw were to happen?

As much as I support our 2nd ammentment as a right reguardless.
Due to the senarios mentioned. Some sort of training/schooling/education will be needed not only for ccw holders but fot law enforcment as well.

Face it years of state policy not allowing anyone but a leo to legally carry in this state will take training and education to over come this states mindstate that anyone with a gun is a bg.

Unless law enforcement along with the ccw holder understand the expected proceedures and laws. There will be conflicts.
Education,education.

I don't recall a training requirement in the 2A. LE training should consist of understanding the Constitution and the BOR

Why is no training required for the well connected now but if MD goes Shall Issue the rest of us are not consideredd competent?