Crofton threats suspect thread

[wilcam47]

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2012/07/colorado-theater-copycat-shooting-suspect-arrested-in-anne-arundel-county-78231.html

Authorities in Prince George's and Anne Arundel counties have foiled what they believe would have been a mass shooting in the style of the one that killed 12 people in a Denver-area movie theater, police sources tell ABC 7 News.

I watched the video again...what is a saiga FN303?? at 1:38 in the video you can see the list

 

[clandestine]

I can understand where you're both coming from after he's been found guilty. Again Section 3 Paragraph 5 of the warrant states pretty clearly their probable cause is based off of a conversation that only his supervisor was privy to. Who knows what was actually said if it wasn't recorded and there are no other witnesses.

He hasn't even had the opportunity to consult with a lawyer.

Again, if he has relayed info you you or his Family then your last statement is not accurate. If he has the opportunity to pass info to anyone then he has an apportunity to get a laywer.

 

[clandestine]

I watched the video again...what is a saiga FN303?? at 1:38 in the video you can see the list

A Saiga 303 is this:

Military Featured Saiga Sporter.

http://www.rwcgroupllc.com/firearms/saiga-shotguns/saiga-303/

 

[z1colt45]

First of all, sorry for the lonnnnnnnnng post.
I am not a lawyer, and don't profess to be one. Also, I am not a LEO, nor do I profess to be one.
Heck. . . . I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express, last night!!!!!

I've read every word in this thread, plus, every word in the warrant, in the post I quoted.

I had some issues and questions.

First of all, when is it a crime to 'spew out stupidity'??? All I can see is that this guy violated the 12th Commandment - "Thou shall not commit stupid." (The 11th Commandment reads as - "Thou shall not commit ugly.")

What PROOF is there, that this guy ACTUALLY made the comments/threats??
It is my understanding that anyone can make a threat at any time, and unless the person has the tools/implements to carry out the 'threat' on his person AT THAT TIME, that this is NO threat.
Also, a threat to commit bodily harm must be made in person.
The only way (that I understand this) to be an actual crime, is IF a threat is made across interstate lines, and then it becomes a federal crime. (Such as. . . making a threat to do bodily harm to someone in Virginia, when the 'threat' is being made in Maryland.)

Next -
The warrant application/affidavit that's posted states that the firearms are (paraphrasing, here) 'usually' secreted to prevent detection by police. (See item #5 in the warrant application.)
What bovine scatology!!! Normally, firearms and ammunition are secreted (or, locked in a safe, or safe place!) to prevent theft by someone entering the home/domicile. (Also known as 'thieves'!!!!!)
That kind of language (in my not-so-humble opinion) wreaks of violating 4th Amendment Rights!!!

Also, the 'victim' stated (in the warrant application), that the 'defendant' owned 'Automatic' firearms!!!
Why wasn't a search done to see if this guy LEGALLY owned 'Automatic' firearms!?!??!!?
I've found over the years, that too many times, the term 'automatic' is incorrect and the term 'semi-automatic' is disregarded or intentionally discounted, for 'attention getting' or 'media ratings'.
(After all, "Ratings" is what gets advertising $$$.)
What I saw on the television, was SEMI-Automatic firearms, not "Automatic".

Now, while I do NOT agree with, or condone this guys ALLEGED actions/words, still, this guy has legal rights.

What happens, when he is found innocent??? (Stranger things have happened!!)
IF this guy IS actually innocent, and has not committed a crime, his name/address has been made public, and he now has been branded as a 'whacko' by the media, police, and others.


We firearms owners/enthusiasts MUST be ever cautious of labeling each other as nutjobs, whackos, idiots, etc., etc., etc., even in jest.

In my not-so-humble opinion, the law enforcement community has a job to do, but, their job should be based on fact, not the 'word' of some guy that gets p-'od at another employee/co-worker and has 'an erection' to get him in trouble.

What this instance does do, is make us all more careful about what we say, or even wear.
(The fact that this guy had on a particular shirt INSIDE HIS OWN HOME!!!!!, and is now ridiculed for it. . . . . I find appalling.)
I wonder what would be said, if I wear a T-shirt that I own. . . . outside. . . . that has a picture of John Wayne on the back, carrying his Winchester '92, and wearing his Colt Peacemaker on his hip, and carrying his saddle, thrown over his shoulder, with these words, "Old Guys Rule"!!!


This will be interesting to see how it 'plays out' in a court of law.
One thing is for certain. . . . . that guy had better 'lawyer up' and 'lawyer up, good'!!!!

I stand by everything I said. I will apologize to him if he never threatened anyone. If he denied he threatened anyone, I doubt we'd be at this point. His friend said the comments were in jest, but guns aren't a joke. He may not be guilty of a crime but he's damaged the public view of owners who would never dream of threatening someone. especially in this day and age with guns being a flashpoint. he showed poor judgement and i don't think he deserves to own them anymore, but thats my opinion.i live in crofton and now every time i load my guns in the car for a trip to the range, people are going to see me and think of him.

 

[wilcam47]

A Saiga 303 is this:

Military Featured Saiga Sporter.

http://www.rwcgroupllc.com/firearms/saiga-shotguns/saiga-303/

ah ok I thought they were making up a name for the saiga.

 

[teratos]

I can understand where you're both coming from after he's been found guilty. Again Section 3 Paragraph 5 of the warrant states pretty clearly their probable cause is based off of a conversation that only his supervisor was privy to. Who knows what was actually said if it wasn't recorded and there are no other witnesses.

He hasn't even had the opportunity to consult with a lawyer.

A conversation between 2 people is all it takes. Let's say someone says they are going to load all their guns and come kill your wife. the conversation is only between your wife and this guy. How would you feel if the police came and said "Well, the conversation was only between your wife and this guy....who knows what was said" and let him out. How would you feel then? Would you feel better if his friends said he was on OK guy. The CO shooter's neighbors said he was a nice quiet guy. Ted Bundy had lots of friends. The police are doing what is right. This is a prime example of "play stupid games, win stupid prizes".

 

[z1colt45]

if he hasn't consulted a lawyer, you probably should not be on here defending him as if he did make the threats...

 

[blackseven]

Again, if he has relayed info you you or his Family then your last statement is not accurate. If he has the opportunity to pass info to anyone then he has an apportunity to get a laywer.

I'm going off the statement out of a news article on the Baltimore Sun stating that he hasn't gotten a lawyer yet. What I do know is that Anne Arundel Medical center is stating that he's no longer at their hospital, beyond that no one knows where he is right now.

 

[wilcam47]

i live in crofton and now every time i load my guns in the car for a trip to the range, people are going to see me and think of him.

I would cover them up with something, put ammo in a gym bag or something...nosey people are fooled easily. Get a small carpet roll your rifles up in them and put them in the trunk...people will think you are OCD and get your carpets cleaned again...but instead you are going to the range.

 

[blackseven]

if he hasn't consulted a lawyer, you probably should not be on here defending him as if he did make the threats...

If I had some first hand knowledge of what happened I'd agree with your statement. I don't and I've never stated that I did. I've got the same information you've got access to through news articles, I'm just reading them from a different point of view then everyone else.

 

[BlackBart]

From what.

Mid 60's or so when it was being built. I don't think townhouses or rentals were part of the master plan. Now it's turned into Columbia East. Yes, it was nice when the only noise one heard was Capitol Dragway where people KNEW what they were in store for before they moved into the place.

 

[z1colt45]

I would cover them up with something, put ammo in a gym bag or something...nosey people are fooled easily. Get a small carpet roll your rifles up in them and put them in the trunk...people will think you are OCD and get your carpets cleaned again...but instead you are going to the range.

haha all my guns are in cases when i load them. im not gonna go thru the effort of concealing them because of this. that's not my point though. my point is that most gun owners are responsible and im tired of ppl like this making the news and becoming the face of gun owners. its his fault and the media's.

 

[Half-cocked]

Hold the presses....

Who is PG's police chief, the one holding Friday's press conference?

Mark Magaw.

Google "mark magaw cheye calvo raid"

Google "mark magaw barbara arnwine raid"

Interesting...

 

[StantonCree]

He made a stupid comment, but according to an Attorney commenting in this mornings Sun making a threat is NOT a crime, attempting to carry it out IS.

So does this justify a big brother mentality what are you thinking? what will you do??

Even worse is when some in government get illegally pro active and deliberately interfere with a persons job and family to attempt to create their self fulfilling belief.

The Constitution is there for a reason.

Ummm I arrest people for threats all the time.

 

[z1colt45]

If I had some first hand knowledge of what happened I'd agree with your statement. I don't and I've never stated that I did. I've got the same information you've got access to through news articles, I'm just reading them from a different point of view then everyone else.

understood. then you don't know if he said it or not either, but you still said this " I believe Neil felt he was in an environment where he could make those comments without them being twisted to be used against him like this." you don't know what context he said it in. what do you think is more likely the witness flat out lied to the police or your buddy said something dumb? the damage is done already. it doesn't matter if they charge him or not.

 

[blackseven]

understood. then you don't know if he said it or not either, but you still said this " I believe Neil felt he was in an environment where he could make those comments without them being twisted to be used against him like this." you don't know what context he said it in. what do you think is more likely the witness flat out lied to the police or your buddy said something dumb? the damage is done already. it doesn't matter if they charge him or not.

I felt the context in which I made that statement was pretty obvious by saying "I believe" not "I know".

 

[z1colt45]

I felt the context in which I made that statement was pretty obvious by saying "I believe" not "I know".

You misread. You don't know what context HE said it in. and there's no proper environment for those comments at all so that argument is moot.

 

[clandestine]

Ummm I arrest people for threats all the time.

Obviously you must not know the Law.

It seems people dont understand the difference between an Arrest Warrant and Search Warrant either.

 

[=GoMango=]

A while back, I "liked" a Facebook Page called "Guns don't kill people, dads with pretty daughters do". I also own a MDShooters T-shirt, and another from "gun-deals.com".

I hope I'm not on some secret MSP list, of "potential mass murderers", now.

I liked the MSP better, back in the days when they were infiltrating peace and anti-death-penalty groups, and conducting intimidation of state workers on behalf of the Governor.

I sure hope no one looks at that facebbok page if your daughter breaks up with her boyfriend
He could say you threatned to shoot him and then....well we all know what happens next

 

[Mr H]

OK...

Again, I'm not condoning or decrying anything this guy may or may not have done...

But I have a few questions for the group.

How many of you have personal experience with workplace violence?

How many of you have witnessed (event or aftermath) someone come in, shoot their supervisor, then turn the gun on themselves?

How many of you really understand the emotional toll an event like that can take on the shooter's family, friends, and coworkers?

Believe me... it's not a fun time. And, because it's Maryland, there is really no way for anyone to stop it. In fact, it's one of the main reasons I got interested in 2A rights.

Let the police investigate, let the docs assess, let due process run its course... and hope this guy doesn't take one in the shorts JUST because it's the media-driven thing to do.

Sure... if he's legitimately guilty, he deserves the consequences. If he's not, then he deserves a fair shake.

But, if it's nothing in your ken, please let it go... because you DON'T know.