Gunbroker and Shipping

[jjones88]

So I made my first purchase on Gunbroker last week after being a long time lurker. I had to contact the seller to see if they would accept paypal and they did but only if it were "gifted" (so to avoid the fee).

When I do "gifting", I always provide the shipping address in the box that paypal allows for messaging. I additionally notify whomever I'm buying something from of the transaction ID as this is often lost, and when I do that email I put my shipping address as a duplicate.

Apparently, I had signed up for gunbroker so long ago that I had no idea that my shipping address was out of date. The seller requested it from gunbroker (instead of using the ones I provided via the other means), therefore got my old address. Looks like the item was delivered today.

Is there a method of filing the claim? Or is this on the seller?

Figured I'd ask here since most of the crowd are avid users of gunbroker!

 

[rseymorejr]

I thought that the sellers were supposed to use the official address that gunbroker has. Either way he should have contacted you about the 2 addresses and got it straightened out.
I had a similar situation and I needed to change my address on gunbroker to match the address on my C&R before the seller would ship.

 

[iH8DemLibz]

Seller used info on GunBroker.

He had no idea it was outdated.

Seller not responsible.

 

[yellowsled]

I am confused. He shipped the firearm to another address, not on the FFL03?

 

[dwnthehatch]

Hopefully you can get it back. I learned the hard way that a "Gift" payment is not covered by PayPal's buyer protection.

 

[Chevyman85]

In the future don't gift money. There's away you can send money the same way you would if they sent you an sales invoice. Be sure to add 2.9% of the total sale extra to cover their fees. This way you have some recourse vs gifting, and the seller still pockets the full sales amount.

 

[Abulg1972]

The seller should contact the shipper, notify the shipper of what was in the package, and ask the shipper to contact the residents of the address and attempt to reclaim the package. Assuming that this is not an antique, the seller has a vested interest in fixing this, as it is a felony to ship a firearm to someone who does not hold an FFL. A seller has a duty to ensure that the shipping address is associated with the buyer. A firearm may be shipped to an address other than the one which appears on the recipient's FFL provided that the person shipping the firearm has taken reasonable steps to confirm that the address belongs to, or is under the control of, the intended recipient. If you sent the seller a copy of your FFL, then he should NOT have shipped the firearm to the address on file with Gunbroker without contacting you. That is on him; he is responsible.

 

[jjones88]

The seller should contact the shipper, notify the shipper of what was in the package, and ask the shipper to contact the residents of the address and attempt to reclaim the package. Assuming that this is not an antique, the seller has a vested interest in fixing this, as it is a felony to ship a firearm to someone who does not hold an FFL. A seller has a duty to ensure that the shipping address is associated with the buyer. A firearm may be shipped to an address other than the one which appears on the recipient's FFL provided that the person shipping the firearm has taken reasonable steps to confirm that the address belongs to, or is under the control of, the intended recipient. If you sent the seller a copy of your FFL, then he should NOT have shipped the firearm to the address on file with Gunbroker without contacting you. That is on him; he is responsible.

This is what I thought, that the C&R FFL address was the go-to one, which is why I always use as many means of communication as possible to inform shipping of this stuff. Was surprised to see on the tracking that it shipped and was delivered to a different address. He's contacted me now and we're both trying to work it.

 

[yellowsled]

He screwed up big time as he should only have shipped to the address on the FFL. BATF might need to be notified if it is not located/returned.

 

[Abulg1972]

He screwed up big time as he should only have shipped to the address on the FFL.

Not true. Well, true in this case, but a statement that a shipper must ship to the address listed on the FFL is not correct. https://www.atf.gov/file/56431/download

Q. Can an FFL ship a firearm to an address that is different from the business premises address identified on the license?

Yes. Neither the GCA nor its implementing regulations contain specific provisions, requiring that an FFL have firearms shipped to their licensed business premises when receiving firearms. To that end, an FFL may lawfully receive firearms at their mailing address, storage location, or other address where the licensee intends to ensure safe and secure receipt of the firearms.

ATF Industry Circular 74-13 outlines “Guidelines for Verifying Identity and Licensed Status of Transferee.” It states, in part, that “when the shipment is to be made to an address other than the transferee’s premises as listed on his or her license or on his or her certified list, it is suggested that the transferor verify the address as being that of the transferee.” Furthermore, pursuant to section 922 (b) of the GCA, it is unlawful to ship a firearm interstate to an unlicensed individual.

We encourage that FFLs verify to the best of their ability that the shipping address is a valid location where the licensee is prepared to receive and subsequently possess the firearms. In addition, if an FFL has customers that require frequent delivery of firearms to an address other than their licensed business premises, we recommend that the shipping address be placed on file with ATF’s Federal Firearms Licensing Center (FFLC) as an additional mailing address.

It should be noted that any FFL receiving firearms at locations other than their licensed premises must maintain accurate records of acquisition and disposition of firearms. The acquisition of firearms must be recorded by the close of the following business day or, if commercial records are maintained, within 7 days following the acquisition (See 27 CFR 478.125(e) and (g)). In the event of an ATF compliance inspection, the FFL must make all records and firearms inventory available for inspection. In addition, if the location is used as a continuous off-site storage facility, the FFL must notify the FFLC so that the address can be placed on file.

 

[jjones88]

The good news is that I just got off the phone with UPS. Even though the system showed "Delivered" it actually wasn't?? It had said "Delivered" earlier but didn't have the First Initial, Last Name of who had signed for the package.

No one is living at the address apparently, so it's on it's way back to the hub and now on it's way back to the seller.

Now I get to figure out how to deal with shipping costs...

 

[PapiBarcelona]

I bought something on gun broker that didn't need an FFL. Had an address on it I'm not using filled out on Gun Broker.

Sent a personal check, and then updated my gun broker info. I think if the seller looks on gun broker when the check clears he will see the correct receiving address.

I tried talking to him (email) about the address correction but he wasn't having it. "Going to ship to the address gun broker says", so he hasn't looked yet.

Its just odd people dont want to work out details on a personalized level.

Either way, if he ships it to my old gun broker address its going to be returned to him, which is why I was trying to mediate a possible issue.

 

[Abulg1972]

The good news is that I just got off the phone with UPS. Even though the system showed "Delivered" it actually wasn't?? It had said "Delivered" earlier but didn't have the First Initial, Last Name of who had signed for the package.

No one is living at the address apparently, so it's on it's way back to the hub and now on it's way back to the seller.

Now I get to figure out how to deal with shipping costs...

I would insist that he pays for the re-ship, as he's the one who made the mistake and shipped to an address other than the one you provided to him. At the end of the day, though, it all depends on how much you want the firearm. If you really want it, then are you going to fight with him over $35?

 

[AssMan]

Since you "gifted" the money, I doubt you will have much leverage. If you are close to the old address, maybe you can grab the delivery sticker off of the door and go pick it up?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[somd_mustangs]

Lesson of the day - make sure your GB address is current

as a seller it's a red flag when I see mismatches between GB, FFL and/or payment addresses.
Of course as a seller I would also contact the buyer first to resolve the discrepancy...

I would recommend NEVER using PayPal for a firearm or anything firearm related.
They are giant prlcks about it and will freeze your account, retrieve money, etc etc.

and if you had gotten an invoice via PayPal (per an early recommendation in the thread) that even hinted at a firearm, both you & the seller would have been screwed by PayPal, see above...

Hopefully this will all work out.

 

[torched02]

PayPal has actually come out over a year ago and stated their policy that in the future they will not allow any firearm related transactions to occur thru their pay portal…….not a 2a friendly payment processor to say the least.

 

[somd_mustangs]

It's been that way a lot longer than a year...

 

[lee2]

never gift money as payment.

 

[protegeV]

never gift money as payment.

This x1,000,000,000,0000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000

 

[240 towles]

never gift money as payment.

yea, everyone knows you western union it.