Is there a suit to fight Maryland's onerous 16 hour training requirement for W and C?

[Blackbeard]

As a permit holder for years, the 16 hours is not excessive and in fact it should be much more. As a former leo I would think you went through substantially more training to become competent.

I am for the right to carry but the idea of a bunch of untrained people running around scares me. I voluntarily went through substantially more training to become as proficient as possible. In fact have a buddy that just got his permit and they didn’t even train on actively drawing from concealment….ridiculous.

 

[teratos]

As a permit holder for years, the 16 hours is not excessive and in fact it should be much more. As a former leo I would think you went through substantially more training to become competent.

I am for the right to carry but the idea of a bunch of untrained people running around scares me. I voluntarily went through substantially more training to become as proficient as possible. In fact have a buddy that just got his permit and they didn’t even train on actively drawing from concealment….ridiculous.

Right? Look at all those problems they are having in Constitutional Carry States. People just blowing each other away left and right. Wait....that isn't actually happening. Infringe harder, Daddy.

 

[Brychan]

I’m totally on board with you, no training requirements are needed. Don’t think they had them in the 1700 to 1800’s from a historical perspective.

They didn't have training requirements here until 2013.

one of the reasons I was one of the 365 after Woolard, was I just had to run out and get printed, and get a photo. Hell by rights they owe me a permit, I didn't withdraw so I didn't get my money back.

 

[press1280]

As a permit holder for years, the 16 hours is not excessive and in fact it should be much more. As a former leo I would think you went through substantially more training to become competent.

I am for the right to carry but the idea of a bunch of untrained people running around scares me. I voluntarily went through substantially more training to become as proficient as possible. In fact have a buddy that just got his permit and they didn’t even train on actively drawing from concealment….ridiculous.

Do you have any stats to back this up?

For example, anything that says that states w/o a training requirement to carry (constitutional carry + license states w/no training requirement) have a higher incidence of accidental shootings?

And, for full disclosure, are you a trainer and do you stand to benefit from a training requirement?

 

[press1280]

They didn't have training requirements here until 2013.

one of the reasons I was one of the 365 after Woolard, was I just had to run out and get printed, and get a photo. Hell by rights they owe me a permit, I didn't withdraw so I didn't get my money back.

And that may be an important factor in a lawsuit challenging the training requirement.

It's not as if the MD GA had been researching this and having hearings and discovered 16 hours of training would cut down on shooting incidents right after a judge struck down G & S. Somehow when only the well connected were able to carry they didn't need training but now that the masses were able to it's all of a sudden an emergency for the training requirement.

 

[Bigfoot21075]

Right? Look at all those problems they are having in Constitutional Carry States. People just blowing each other away left and right. Wait....that isn't actually happening. Infringe harder, Daddy.

Yeah it is a horror isn't it? All of those people carrying because it is their right to do so.

Blackbeard, why stop there? By your logic, this massive training should be completed even before you own a firearm. Well, then maybe only certain people who have demonstrated the mental capacity to own such a thing should even be allowed to attempt the training. Let's require a college degree to own a firearm, make it a masters after all a BS is just that BS.

Legal gun owners ARE NOT THE PROBLEM, 16 hour course or not, LEGAL GUN OWNERS ARE NOT THE PROBLEM. Areas that are Constitutional carry do not suffer from lack of training for their citizens. Maryland's 16 hour requirement is onerous.

 

[press1280]

Right? Look at all those problems they are having in Constitutional Carry States. People just blowing each other away left and right. Wait....that isn't actually happening. Infringe harder, Daddy.

I'd say that the training is more to prevent accidents. If someone has evil intents then you won't "train" it out of them with a 16 hour class.

 

[Bigfoot21075]

I'd say that the training is more to prevent accidents. If someone has evil intents then you won't "train" it out of them with a 16 hour class.

You won't train an accident from stupidity out of them either.

 

[Brute]

Right? Look at all those problems they are having in Constitutional Carry States. People just blowing each other away left and right. Wait....that isn't actually happening. Infringe harder, Daddy.

I've been in Iowa all week. It's permitless carry. Somehow I Mad Max'd my way here driving through WV, OH, and Indiana. I even was able to pick up a sandwich from The Hungry Hobo yesterday and not get shot while waiting in line. So far I've managed to avoid a negligent discharge while carrying myself despite my only documented training being my HQL and the 4 hours for my Utah permit. It's just utter pandemonium out here.

 

[swinokur]

I can’t to finish my safe prayer class so I can attend synagogue


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[eruby]

I can’t to finish my safe prayer class so I can attend synagogue

Join Temple B'nai eruby

We have permit-less praying

And hamantaschen

 

[teratos]

I'd say that the training is more to prevent accidents. If someone has evil intents then you won't "train" it out of them with a 16 hour class.

I don't think 16 hours is going to help much with accidents, either.

 

[Blaster229]

Seersucker or zoot suit? Let's start a poll.

 

[DC-W]

As a permit holder for years, the 16 hours is not excessive and in fact it should be much more. As a former leo I would think you went through substantially more training to become competent.

I am for the right to carry but the idea of a bunch of untrained people running around scares me. I voluntarily went through substantially more training to become as proficient as possible. In fact have a buddy that just got his permit and they didn’t even train on actively drawing from concealment….ridiculous.

Respectfully, there are few things lower than demanding that others’ rights are restricted and criminalized to your personal whims.

25 states require no permit to carry a firearm in public at all. Most states that do have training requirements that are fulfilled with short classes or by otherwise producing some proof of basic knowledge of firearm safety. Others have none at all. The trend is continuing to skew towards less criminalization of and government interference in carrying guns in public for most of the country, save for states like NY, MD, and few others. The sky hasn’t burned and the world hasn’t turned over.

Training is great. Learning is great. Those should always be encouraged, but they should never, ever be leveraged against one’s individual right to self preservation. Not everyone has the means to bear such expenses, but everyone does have a right to bear arms.

 

[E.Shell]

Seersucker or zoot suit? Let's start a poll.

Seersucker for me. Zoot Suits make my ass look big.

 

[Boondock Saint]

Respectfully, there are few things lower than demanding that others’ rights are restricted and criminalized to your personal whims.

25 states require no permit to carry a firearm in public at all. Most states that do have training requirements that are fulfilled with short classes or by otherwise producing some proof of basic knowledge of firearm safety. Others have none at all. The trend is continuing to skew towards less criminalization of and government interference in carrying guns in public for most of the country, save for states like NY, MD, and few others. The sky hasn’t burned and the world hasn’t turned over.

Training is great. Learning is great. Those should always be encouraged, but they should never, ever be leveraged against one’s individual right to self preservation. Not everyone has the means to bear such expenses, but everyone does have a right to bear arms.

Yes.

 

[Bigfoot21075]

Respectfully, there are few things lower than demanding that others’ rights are restricted and criminalized to your personal whims.

25 states require no permit to carry a firearm in public at all. Most states that do have training requirements that are fulfilled with short classes or by otherwise producing some proof of basic knowledge of firearm safety. Others have none at all. The trend is continuing to skew towards less criminalization of and government interference in carrying guns in public for most of the country, save for states like NY, MD, and few others. The sky hasn’t burned and the world hasn’t turned over.

Training is great. Learning is great. Those should always be encouraged, but they should never, ever be leveraged against one’s individual right to self preservation. Not everyone has the means to bear such expenses, but everyone does have a right to bear arms.

GREAT reply. Well done.

 

[swinokur]

Join Temple B'nai eruby

We have permit-less praying

And hamantaschen

Can’t wait for Shabbat services. I’ll be the guy packing

Yum


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[Biggfoot44]

Less eloquently than D-CW :

Well more tham half the country is either CC or Shall Issue w/o Training . It works .

Yes , I frequent areas with pimple faced teenagers legally open carrying with no Govt mandated training , and it concerns me zero being around them .

********8*****************

Mind you , I am totally in favor of effective skills , and important knowledge . My suggested best practices skills for reasonably healthy people is probably higher than most peoples concepts of mandated training .

But they need to voluntarily seek it , of their own judgement . People choosing to gain skills , at their selected levels , will be much more skilled and knowledgeable , than equal time and $ spent in lowest common denominator Government mandated training .

 

[Allen65]

As a permit holder for years, the 16 hours is not excessive and in fact it should be much more. As a former leo I would think you went through substantially more training to become competent.

I am for the right to carry but the idea of a bunch of untrained people running around scares me. I voluntarily went through substantially more training to become as proficient as possible. In fact have a buddy that just got his permit and they didn’t even train on actively drawing from concealment….ridiculous.

Hours should not be the metric for skills obtained, testing should be. If there is to be some sort of mandatory minimum set of skills for CCW, then that should be tested for with an objective set of performance standards. At least that would let people who have had other (often extensive) non-Maryland-approved training test out of keeping a chair warm in a classroom for 16 hours.

The idea of MGA members who simply hate private firearms ownership, and who know nothing about carrying and operating firearms safely, setting training standards is simply absurd.