MG questions

[BLACKTALON]

My uncle is very well off and always tells me and my sister to invest he gave me $1500 to buy stock with this Xmas and I am doing pretty well. If I do research and show the possibility for a return on my investment on a MG he said he would consider it this Xmas. I know I wont be able to convince him of a M-16 but maybe a mac or something. where would I go to see the price changes of MG's over the years? and sites to look at for potential buys ?
I know subguns,sturmwerks andgunbroker any other good sites to watch

 

[ericoak]

http://www.machinegunpriceguide.com/

Good place to get ball park numbers.

 

[Afdiesel]

Show him some trends on higher dollar guns like HK MP5's and make sure that he understands that there is a finite number of guns on the market. In my opinion the lower value guns are going to inflate as HK's, M60's, and even M16's overprice themselves for the majority of buyers on the market. Those big numbers are going to find their way into the MAC's, Sten's and Reisings.

 

[pwoolford]

My uncle is very well off and always tells me and my sister to invest he gave me $1500 to buy stock with this Xmas and I am doing pretty well. If I do research and show the possibility for a return on my investment on a MG he said he would consider it this Xmas. I know I wont be able to convince him of a M-16 but maybe a mac or something. where would I go to see the price changes of MG's over the years? and sites to look at for potential buys ?
I know subguns,sturmwerks andgunbroker any other good sites to watch

I would show him the value of the M16's and Tommy guns also since they are all going up. I don't see how you can go wrong investing in MG's.

 

[ericoak]

You have to be honest with him though and advise that unlike most other investments, there is a chance the government could make your gun worth $0 overnight.

 

[IMBLITZVT]

MGs values are certainly subject to political destruction.

They could make them legal to make again, Making a $22K M16A1 worth less than about $1K.

They could make MGs illegal to sell, turning your invest priceless and valueless.

They could come confiscated them.

That said, there are also many factors going into MG values. The latest values have been driven by ammo and the economy. We saw $35K M2HBs sink as low as $11k at one point.

Also to get a good investment you must buy at the low point. Right now we have seen a serious increase in M16, Mac, Uzi, HK sears, AR15 LL, DIASs, FNCs....etc prices. So I don't know that I would suggest any of them as an undervalued investment. Many historical guns, like Jap MGs, have maybe lost a little value due to the economy. There is a split between Shooters and Collectors in MGs. Collects do spend money but don't tend to spend premiums. There is also a larger market for them. The shooters are much more limited and basically go after the latest designs available.

Finally you have future MG development. Since no new MGs can enter the market, uppers of all types are the future. We have seen M11 and all macs to an extent and M16s take the lead in this area. This is part of the reason these two guns are increasing in value so quickly. HK sears have always fit a wide ranges of guns and keeps them high.

If I was asked what I thought the best deal on the market was, I would say a 1919a4 Plate gun under $15K. This is one of the only rifle caliber MGs that can be converted to fire almost any caliber including 7.62x54r and 7.62x39. These two calibers will drive the market as surplus 308 and 3006 goes away. With cheap imports and tons of guns in the US shooting these calibers, its the one to have.

So like an investment, it will depend on how much you want to study the subject to make a good investment. Then you must find the right gun at the right price.

 

[coopermania]

That's a good post above Sir, I was one when I was a younger man that delved into the mg market years ago when mac 10s were 250 bucks or less, Colt M16s were 450 bucks and belt feds were 2000 dollars.
My father shook his head when I told him I spent 2200 on a new in the crate saco m60. I shot them a lot way back then and then they sat as safe queens and now my kid is starting to play with them. As a young man I was lucky enough to have friends that worked as sales reps / owned stores or worked for a local firearm distributor. And they were kind enough to sell those of us in the group used sales samples or new guns at nice discounts. Are they good investments in my opinion ? Yes if you buy well, Less than 2 years ago FNC's were about 7500 I see now they are about 14000. You gotta buy smart. At least now days anyway.
Do I think the government is going to take them away ? Ahhh. NOPE
Will they ever finish the Amnesty .... NOPE
Will they ever allow manufacture of more transferable machine guns .... NOPE.

If I was to buy a transferable machine gun now I would either buy a M16 sear / H&K sear pack and if I was to buy a gun I would get a FNC, A highly underrated rifle.
All of this is just my opinion and nothing more. Good Luck.

 

[ericoak]

That's a good post above Sir, I was one when I was a younger man that delved into the mg market years ago when mac 10s were 250 bucks or less, Colt M16s were 450 bucks and belt feds were 2000 dollars.
My father shook his head when I told him I spent 2200 on a new in the crate saco m60. I shot them a lot way back then and then they sat as safe queens and now my kid is starting to play with them. As a young man I was lucky enough to have friends that worked as sales reps / owned stores or worked for a local firearm distributor. And they were kind enough to sell those of us in the group used sales samples or new guns at nice discounts. Are they good investments in my opinion ? Yes if you buy well, Less than 2 years ago FNC's were about 7500 I see now they are about 14000. You gotta buy smart. At least now days anyway.
Do I think the government is going to take them away ? Ahhh. NOPE
Will they ever finish the Amnesty .... NOPE
Will they ever allow manufacture of more transferable machine guns .... NOPE.

If I was to buy a transferable machine gun now I would either buy a M16 sear / H&K sear pack and if I was to buy a gun I would get a FNC, A highly underrated rifle.
All of this is just my opinion and nothing more. Good Luck.

I think you under estimate how easy it would be for them to ban future sale or transfer. That would be a lot easier to accomplish than "taking them away". I don't think any of the Supreme Court Justices would have much of a problem with it either based on their questions and comments in Heller and McDonald.

 

[coopermania]

I think you under estimate how easy it would be for them to ban future sale or transfer. That would be a lot easier to accomplish than "taking them away". I don't think any of the Supreme Court Justices would have much of a problem with it either based on their questions and comments in Heller and McDonald.

Eric, I guess you missed the disclaimer I put as my last sentence.

All of this is just my opinion and nothing more. Good Luck.

 

[ericoak]

Eric, I guess you missed the disclaimer I put as my last sentence.

All of this is just my opinion and nothing more. Good Luck.

I saw it, we just disagree on one of those three. They definitely aren't doing another amnesty and they definitely aren't letting you buy new ones.

I could also see MD refusing to sign on off on Form 4s anymore, that wouldn't even take a law since it is up to the CLEO. But that would have limited impact on the value of the weapon.

And I hope you are right!

 

[Alphabrew]

Government regulation plays way too much into the prices for me to use MGs as an investment. The anticipated return would have to pretty high for the risks, and I'm not seeing it.

 

[IMBLITZVT]

I could also see MD refusing to sign on off on Form 4s anymore, that wouldn't even take a law since it is up to the CLEO. But that would have limited impact on the value of the weapon. !

I believe MD is shall issue on the sign off. So MSP will always sign unless they have a real reason. Unless the law changes but thats unlikely as they think MGs are already illegal.

Government regulation plays way too much into the prices for me to use MGs as an investment. The anticipated return would have to pretty high for the risks, and I'm not seeing it.

Yeah I agree a bit. However would you buy a Diamond... not much different. How about a house? Seems to me the government just blew the value up 3-4x by giving away money with no interest. Then the values fell big time. The economy just died and so did pries on boats, cars and most big ticket luxury investment type purchases. The stock market fell big time. Most MGs out performed all those big time! Plus you get to shoot them while you have them. So even if you just break even, you win. If SHTF, it will be worth more than Gold. Bascially, unless you think things are going to get better and the Government will trust us again enough to let us make our own MGs again... well then they are fairly safe investment assuming you make the right purchase.

FNCs have already gone up a lot in value lately! So have M16s and M16 sears have gone up and are crazy expensive. HK sears are up a very good amount. These prices are maxing out right now IMHO. If I was looking for an investment gun I would be looking for something that has not jumped in value but should soon. Like the 1919a4. Frankly I think the M11 will continue to go up too because of the new uppers out for it. It really should be priced not much below the Uzi and right now its far less.

 

[ericoak]

I believe MD is shall issue on the sign off. So MSP will always sign unless they have a real reason. Unless the law changes but thats unlikely as they think MGs are already illegal.



Yeah I agree a bit. However would you buy a Diamond... not much different. How about a house? Seems to me the government just blew the value up 3-4x by giving away money with no interest. Then the values fell big time. The economy just died and so did pries on boats, cars and most big ticket luxury investment type purchases. The stock market fell big time. Most MGs out performed all those big time! Plus you get to shoot them while you have them. So even if you just break even, you win. If SHTF, it will be worth more than Gold. Bascially, unless you think things are going to get better and the Government will trust us again enough to let us make our own MGs again... well then they are fairly safe investment assuming you make the right purchase.

FNCs have already gone up a lot in value lately! So have M16s and M16 sears have gone up and are crazy expensive. HK sears are up a very good amount. These prices are maxing out right now IMHO. If I was looking for an investment gun I would be looking for something that has not jumped in value but should soon. Like the 1919a4. Frankly I think the M11 will continue to go up too because of the new uppers out for it. It really should be priced not much below the Uzi and right now its far less.

You think there is a specific law that says MSP has to sign off on CLEO? I have never heard of that.

Even if there was though, if they can get SB281 passed they could easily ban "machine guns, silencers, and sawed off shotguns". Those sound even scarier than assault weapons.

 

[IMBLITZVT]

You think there is a specific law that says MSP has to sign off on CLEO? I have never heard of that.

Even if there was though, if they can't get SB281 passed they could easily ban "machine guns, silencers, and sawed off shotguns" with ease.

I thought I remember reading that somewhere in the law but you know how it is when you start looking for something. Maybe I got it confused with this:

§ 4-403. Registration of machine gun

(2) The Secretary of State Police shall prepare and, on request of an applicant, furnish an application form for registration under this subsection.

However this is talking about the MD registration, not the Federal registrations. I will keep looking for where I saw it.

 

[rico903]

I thought I remember reading that somewhere in the law but you know how it is when you start looking for something. Maybe I got it confused with this:



However this is talking about the MD registration, not the Federal registrations. I will keep looking for where I saw it.

I believe you are correct about MSP signing off because most county CLEOs will not but if anyone lives in a a county like Carroll County they are lucky.