Old Revolver Question

[babalou]

I apologize if this is in the wrong forum. My younger brother Chris went to bed a few weeks ago and never woke up. He was only 34.

Anyway, when another sibling and I were going through Chris' room, we happen to find behind a dresser and old black powder revolver. From what I determined, it is an old Allen & Wheelock 1858 7 round .22 side hammer with maple handle pieces. It was nasty. I took it apart and cleaned the maple with Regency Gold and submerged the parts of the pistol in KRIOL in baggies for like two days. I have not cleaned the bore or cylinder holes yet. I will do so later. I have seen where others online have found these in old houses in the south. They tried to shoot with .22 shorts only to have it blow up in there hands. So, looks like it should shoot the CP Cap or BB Cap rounds since only the primer propels it. So, like .22 air rifle in power. Two things. One, should I attempt to shoot it or no?- I am leaning no. Two, for what was this used? Pest control indoors? I would not think it could be used for self defense.. I am posting two pics. It may look fugly, but it looks a lot better now than it did prior. Also, I cannot for the life of me cram that main spring back into the handle without tearing up the inside. I assume I can take it to an armorer of some sort?

 

[Mooseman]

Wow, sorry about your brother. I know noting about that revolver other than it is cool looking.

 

[Doctor_M]

Condolences on your loss.

Decision on if you should fire this depends on the actual condition of the individual gun. I have several "suicide specials" from this era that I do fire (CB caps or black powder ammo if you can find it) and several that I won't. Check it out very carefully. Look for metal fatigue and thickness of the metal in around the cylinder wall. Also check the barrel carefully once you've cleaned it out. The old BP ammo could cause a lot of corrosion over the years. The next thing to check is the timing and lock-up. Most accidents with these old revolvers come from incorrect timing and not so much the metal fatigue. If the firing cylinder doesn't lock up 100% in alignment with the barrel, then it is a wall hanger. Interesting looking little gun. I haven't looked it up, but I'm guessing in this condition it is probably $600-700 range. Side hammers tend to be worth a good bit. If you decide to test fire... wear gloves and eye protection.

 

[babalou]

Thanks for the condolences. Thanks for the great info. I saw that it was made from like 1858 to 1865. And about more than 1500 made. The wheel had six sides... here is from gunsinternational

Category - Antique Cartridge Revolvers & Pistols Antique Cartridge Revolvers & Pistols
Guns International #: 100506545


Lister Inventory #: 13-80
Allen & Wheelock 22 Sidehammer Rimfire Revolver

Description:
Allen & Wheelock 22 Sidehammer Rimfire Revolver .22 caliber Sidehammer Rimfire Revolver made by Allen and Wheelock, Ethan Allen & Co. Made c. 1858-1865, total quantity estimated over 1,500. 22 rimfire; 7-shot cylinder. Barrel length 2 1/2”. All barrels octagonal. Iron frames. Walnut grips, blued finish. Barrel markings: ALLEN & WHEELOCK, WORCESTER, MASS. U.S./ALLEN’S PATENTS SEPT. 7, NOV.9 1858. On the frame: JULY 3, 1860. Cylinders are engraved with five circular panels depicting mounted rider, standing Indian (seal of Massachusetts), ship and other military trophy deigns.
Early model: cylinder pin of long, narrow, round shape entering from rear; hammer strikes to right of center; grip frame has comparatively sharp drop. Grooved topstrap for sighting.

So this one may be a later model from early 1860's. cannot see the date on the underside of the barrel.

 

[Bootknife]

Sorry for Your Loss, I have Lost both of My Brothers so I feel Your pain!

 

[babalou]

Bootknife, my sincere condolences. I come from a big family. We have defied the odds when it comes to tragedies. A lot of families of equal and even smaller size- like yours have had these. It was our time. it is far different to console someone else who has lost a family member, but when it happens to you..... you know.... I really was not expecting this sort of thing for another 30-40 years. Besides grandparents, etc.

Again, I am so very sorry for your losses. When I say good-night to my brother tonight, I will also say it to the brothers of Bootknife!!

 

[Bootknife]

Thanks Babalou...We will all meet again on God's Golden Shore!

 

[babalou]

yeah, as long as my brother leaves some fish for me to try to catch

 

[babalou]

online shows exactly what mine is supposed to look like. Will soak some more. Would like to clean out the pits better..

 

[BigDaddy]

Condolences on your loss.

I shoot all my guns, but I don't have one this old nor do I have any super engraved valuable guns. Still I'm hard pressed to find a reason to shoot a 160 year old pistol other than just to say you shot it.

I would clean it with normal gun cleaning techniques but I would not attempt any restoration type work.

 

[j8064]

I too give my condolences on your family's loss.

Personally I would not dream of firing that pistol. Mooseman is our Hooligan Guinea Pig and I wouldn't even put HIM up to that.

If it was mine I'd reassemble it with no further cleaning and find or build a velvet lined storage box for it. It's a relic...and it's a retired antique IMO.

 

[Threeband]

... Two, for what was this used? Pest control indoors? I would not think it could be used for self defense...

People tend to think any firearm is a formidable weapon.

I read of a Confederate partisan officer who used such a gun, a S&W, to execute prisoners with a single shot to the base of the skull. (Yes, he sounds like a sick psychopath.)

Mark Twain carried a S&W .22 short when he went to Nevada in 1861, as he recounted in Roughing It.

"I was armed to the teeth with a pitiful little Smith and Wesson seven shooter that carried a ball like a homeopathic pill, and it took the whole seven to make a dose for an adult. But I thought it was grand. It appeared to me to be a dangerous weapon."

People still carry those little NAA mini-revolvers. Some are .22 short only. I'll bet some people think they are armed to the teeth with a dangerous weapon.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Condolences on your loss.

Back in the day , that was indeed a self defense pistol , and undoubtedly they saw use in the Civil War as private purchases by officers , and "unofficial" use by others.

Back in the day , simply being a ctg pistol when virtually everything else was percussion , lent everything a measure of gravitas for all weather reliability and speed of reload , even if small cal.

And as sugguested , stabilize it , but don't take any refinishing.

 

[babalou]

Oh, I would not refinish it. I had the same conversation with Boss66tcode about an old Savage 6A pre 1945 given to me. It says Utica, NY on it so it is prior to them moving to CT. He told me the same thing. I will heed your advices. I just want to clean up the pit rust. I am leaning with j8064. I want to take care of it like the Wheeler Dealer guys where they find older cars and bring them back. Unlike them though, I just want it to be clean of rust and crud. As Boss66 said, leave to have the character. Thanks so much for the possible use for it. I just assumed since it really does not have any power- BP 22? it could not do much damage. I stand corrected. Cool pocket gun Thanks all!! Good Night to all, my brother, and to the brothers of Bootknife!!

 

[babalou]

Thanks for all the condolences. Much appreciated.

 

[Doctor_M]

People tend to think any firearm is a formidable weapon.

I read of a Confederate partisan officer who used such a gun, a S&W, to execute prisoners with a single shot to the base of the skull. (Yes, he sounds like a sick psychopath.)

Mark Twain carried a S&W .22 short when he went to Nevada in 1861, as he recounted in Roughing It.

People still carry those little NAA mini-revolvers. Some are .22 short only. I'll bet some people think they are armed to the teeth with a dangerous weapon.

Concur. These were intended to be personal self-defense weapons. Effective range of "across a card table". One thing to keep in mind is a century ago, a small wound like from a .22 short could effectively do you in. Medical services were provided by "barber-surgeons" and with no antibiotics. If you could even get to a doctor (no guarantee) there was a high probability that a gut shot even from a .22 would result in a slow and very painful death.

We tend to think of .22 as an ineffective SD round, but even with the likelihood of surviving a wound with modern day medicine... I would not volunteer to take a bullet from one of these. It was a light, cheap, last ditch type weapon.... kind of why they are so neat and why so many folks collect them. Lots of history in that little gun. Cheers.

 

[babalou]

ah

Concur. These were intended to be personal self-defense weapons. Effective range of "across a card table". One thing to keep in mind is a century ago, a small wound like from a .22 short could effectively do you in. Medical services were provided by "barber-surgeons" and with no antibiotics. If you could even get to a doctor (no guarantee) there was a high probability that a gut shot even from a .22 would result in a slow and very painful death.

We tend to think of .22 as an ineffective SD round, but even with the likelihood of surviving a wound with modern day medicine... I would not volunteer to take a bullet from one of these. It was a light, cheap, last ditch type weapon.... kind of why they are so neat and why so many folks collect them. Lots of history in that little gun. Cheers.

Good to know. Makes sense.

 

[Magnumite]

Condolensces to you and yours, babalou. One of my brothers was 39 when the same thing occured.

I concur with previous posts made. A nice presentation box or wall shadow box would be appropriate. Hung where not just anyone could see it and 'mark' your residence.

 

[babalou]

Magnumite, sounds good. I will enjoy it as is.

 

[babalou]

sorry for your loss

Condolensces to you and yours, babalou. One of my brothers was 39 when the same thing occured.

I concur with previous posts made. A nice presentation box or wall shadow box would be appropriate. Hung where not just anyone could see it and 'mark' your residence.

Sorry for your loss.