Single Stage vs. Turret

[jkray]

This is not the typical which should I get question. I have been reading through the pages here and many times the suggestion is made to start with a single stage press then upgrade later. And the reason for this is you can be more precise and learn what you are doing better with a single stage

Without having read any manuals or other books I have been doing research on different presses and what not, and have come to the conclusion that a turret press offers more benefits to the newbie than a single stage, and here is why.

With a single stage you must do batches of one step then change the die and do batches of the subsequent steps. This seems to be very tedious and time consuming being that you must set up each die correctly for each step.
However with a turret press you can set up each die correctly before going through everything and do one whole round before moving on. Maybe its just my way of thinking but I would much rather do one round and figure it out that way then to do one step for a bunch then move on the the next.

Also for prescion work it has been said that the single stage is better because you have more control. But I think you can have just as much control with a turret especially if you deactivate the auto indexing. you are still only doing one round at a time.

These are just some observations I have made without reading anything or buying anything. If someone has a little better insight into this please weigh in because I do not want to start with bad preconceptions.

 

[WheelHead]

I'd like to have a turret, but have been loading on a single so long that I just feel its adequate enough for my needs. And actually I've become pretty good with my process from start to finish. Maybe someday I'll get another press. When my single stage wears out......

 

[kalister1]

I think it all comes down to how many rounds per month you reload?
On a Single Stage press you set up your dies ONE time. Once the locking ring is set you simply run it down to the stop and go.

 

[lx1x]

It just depends. The lee press I have is a quick release bushings. Dont really have to reset the dies. Just quick twist and switch.

 

[JamesBailey]

How many cartridges do you load?

The big advantage of the turret is that you never move your dies. If you don't move your dies, they always stay in the same location. If they are in the same location, they are more likely to be consistent piece to piece. More consistent = better ammo

Personally, I love my Redding T-7 turret. It feels like a Sherman tank. I load three precision rifle cartridges, so I have all my dies on one turret and they never move. It saves time but more importantly, removes one variable of inconsistency.

There is no difference to starting with a turret press or starting with a single stage press. Don't not get a turret because you are a beginner.

 

[A. Wayne]

I wholeheartedly recommend starting out with a turret! The best thing IMHO opinion with the turret is you do not need to remove and reinstall dies to change an operation. Spend some time setting up all of your dies one time. I however don't want to bother with creating one completed round at a time. I think you will wind up with better ammo by doing the processes as batches. It would most likely wind up to be faster as well.
I sit down and re-size/de-prime a few hundred, then prime a few hundred with a hand primer tool and drop em in a tupperware container for later use. When ready to load, I flare and charge 50 to 100 round in one operation, and visually check the cases for charge level consistencies (you cannot do this if you make a completed cartridge every time using an auto index or manually twisting the turret). When complete I turn the turret to seat and crimp bullets in those charged cases.
Using this method I get a couple hundred an hour, and don't ever mess with the dies.
Works well for me.

 

[jkray]

How many cartridges do you load?

I dont yet, I am still in the research phase (read not enough funds yet) and per usuall when I am getting into something the first time I over think and over analyze every little detail.

I am looking at the Lee Classic 4 Hole Turret Kit to start with and would get a couple of turret plates as I would be reloading a couple of different rounds.

 

[A. Wayne]

I dont yet, I am still in the research phase (read not enough funds yet) and per usuall when I am getting into something the first time I over think and over analyze every little detail.

I am looking at the Lee Classic 4 Hole Turret Kit to start with and would get a couple of turret plates as I would be reloading a couple of different rounds.

I recommend your selection. I have a 10 year old 3 hole turret press with extra turret for 9x18. I drop in the turret and go when I change calibers, I actually have two Auto disk powder measures as well - each pre set to individual caliber, so I do not even adjust it. Oil the ram and linkage when you think about it and it will last a long time.

 

[jkray]

good idea with the multiple powder measures, although if I did that I can see myself having about 6 of them for each of the loads I intend to reload for. .45, 9mm, and 30-06 right off the bat then .223, 45 Colt, and .357 once I get the guns for them

 

[herr.baer]

I use a Lee turret as well. I reload for .30-06, .357, .45 , 10mm and soon .308. I have an extra plate for each set of dies.

For pistol I just use a Lyman powder drop. For the rifles I like to more exact so I use the Lee Dipper to get close and then trickle the rest in. I measure each load for rifle.

 

[Eviljagtech]

I started with the RCBS Rockchunker kit, which comes with almost everything you need to start. Sense I was reloading only 9mm at the time and the takes for ever in a single stage press, I got the Dillon square B deal and love it for the price even though it only reloads 9mm i go through a bit of it. I still use the RCBS press for my rifle ammo as its more consistent ( and can easily adjust to make top ammo) for my .223, 7.62-54r and now 30-06.

I'd say if you are doing pistol (9mm, .40, 45acp ect.) turret would be better as auto loader eat them like candy. If rifle I would go to the single as rifle reloading needs a little more TLC then small pistol rounds.

just my 2cents

 

[skidmoe77]

I use the Lee classic turret. Its a great press for the money. I've got over 5000 rounds threw it. A.Wayne is right just oil it and it will last for a long time.

 

[Kizmit99]

I wholeheartedly recommend starting out with a turret! The best thing IMHO opinion with the turret is you do not need to remove and reinstall dies to change an operation. Spend some time setting up all of your dies one time. I however don't want to bother with creating one completed round at a time. I think you will wind up with better ammo by doing the processes as batches. It would most likely wind up to be faster as well.
I sit down and re-size/de-prime a few hundred, then prime a few hundred with a hand primer tool and drop em in a tupperware container for later use. When ready to load, I flare and charge 50 to 100 round in one operation, and visually check the cases for charge level consistencies (you cannot do this if you make a completed cartridge every time using an auto index or manually twisting the turret). When complete I turn the turret to seat and crimp bullets in those charged cases.
Using this method I get a couple hundred an hour, and don't ever mess with the dies.
Works well for me.

I second this. It's exactly how I do it, and personally I wouldn't want a progressive - I appreciate being able to double check each batch after each step in the process. I have the Lee 3 hole turret (over 20yrs old at this point) and it's still going strong. IMO separate plates for each caliber is a must, and I would definitely recommend at least considering a separate auto-disk powder drop for each (pistol caliber) plate - their only about $25 each.

 

[j8064]

This is not the typical which should I get question. I have been reading through the pages here and many times the suggestion is made to start with a single stage press then upgrade later. And the reason for this is you can be more precise and learn what you are doing better with a single stage

Without having read any manuals or other books I have been doing research on different presses and what not, and have come to the conclusion that a turret press offers more benefits to the newbie than a single stage, and here is why.

With a single stage you must do batches of one step then change the die and do batches of the subsequent steps. This seems to be very tedious and time consuming being that you must set up each die correctly for each step.
However with a turret press you can set up each die correctly before going through everything and do one whole round before moving on. Maybe its just my way of thinking but I would much rather do one round and figure it out that way then to do one step for a bunch then move on the the next.

Also for prescion work it has been said that the single stage is better because you have more control. But I think you can have just as much control with a turret especially if you deactivate the auto indexing. you are still only doing one round at a time.

These are just some observations I have made without reading anything or buying anything. If someone has a little better insight into this please weigh in because I do not want to start with bad preconceptions.

I don't intend to write a book here, just input from many years of reloading experience FWIW:

The two highlighted points in jkray's OP are why I'll always recommend a beginner start with a single stage press. Without realizing it he actually states it himself: "the reason for this is you can be more precise and learn what you are doing better with a single stage"...But he also states, "This seems to be very tedious and time consuming being that you must set up each die correctly for each step." That is the lesson here! There is NO shortcutting in good reloading practice. Now let me explain:

Learning the function, nuances and adjustment of each die and its proper setup relative to the batch of cases being reloaded is fundamentally critical. Adjustments can change with cases, powder, crimp requirements and bullets used - even within one batch of reloads. All with consideration of the firearm in which the cartridge will be used.

Reloading pistol cases is not the same as reloading rifle cases. Loading a .380 is not the same as loading a .44 mag. Loading a .22 Hornet is not the same as loading a 30-06. And all the calibers in between have their differences. Different brands of brass and/or bullets adds yet another dynamic to an already complicated process.

We'll all agree there is zero tolerence for mistakes in reloading. For a beginner, a single stage press requires that the reloader focus attention on each step of the process. When something isn't 100%, you make any necessary adjustments while loading a particular batch or caliber.

I use a turret press. It's convenient because I can shift from one die to another easily. But after 20+ years of reloading over 20 different calibers, I also use my single stage presses for certain tasks. Why? Because they are tools that ultimately make me confident 100% of my reloads will fire perfectly and safely.

 

[DocAitch]

Turret Press

jk,
I also think that the Lee Classic Turret press is an excellent choice for all the reasons that you state except one.The main advantage that you point out is leaving the tool head set up with one caliber's dies and simply installing the head and shell holder for a caliber change (although you will have to change the seating depth if you change bullets-which can be often-but with the Lee dies, this is no big deal)
I do think that, especially as a new reloader, you may be courting trouble if you attempt to use the turret to load an entire round from start to finish rather than batching and this is why- if you batch you are afforded the opportunity to check each case at every step, the most important being to eyeball your powder level in 50 or 100 cases side by side in a loading block. I find that you can pick up relatively subtle variations in the powder levels. The double charge /squib problem is the most common dangerous situation that you can get into and this sequence of events is such that a moment's inattention can result in either.
I realize that the single round to finish method seems more efficient because you eliminate moving the case in and out of the shell holder several hundred times per hundred rounds, but I think that a true time motion study would take into account the fact that doing the same thing 100 times and then changing is easier than doing 4-5 different things in sequence 100 times, and the second method is much more prone to an error that you won't catch because the bullet is hiding the powder level (or lack there of).
DocAitch

 

[jkray]

j8064 and DocAitch,

Very well put statements. I can see the benefits of having a single stage press as a new reloader. So I think it should be said that I think I will still go with the Lee Turret as my first press and until I am confident in my ability, turn off the auto index feature and treat it like a single stage. This way when I want to upgrade all I have to do is re-engage the idexing and away I go.

I see this as a benefit in a two of ways. I save money in not having to buy multiple presses, I can keep all of my dies for one caliber together on the plate, and adjust as necessary.

 

[sbbieshelt]

I have a single stage that I learned with and if I did it over I would have gotten a turret press. For small quantities batches are fine but once you have a load dialed in and you just want to load up 500 or so for a day of shooting the turret press would be very nice to have.

 

[zebramochaman]

I am a new reloader and had done extensive research before I acquired my Lee Classic Turret Press.
My reasons for selecting the turret over the single stage were: the cost was not that much more for equipment that will last longer than I will; the turret can be operated in single stage mode by removing the index rod (I have produced several test batches of ammo operating the press in single stage), you can set up all of your dies at the same time and then rotate to the station you are using for that process, and when you are confident enough to use the turret function you will be able to produce batches at a much higher output than with a single stage.
For me, it did not make sense to buy a single stage and then possibly buy a turret or progressive down the road.
The Lee Classic Turret Press is an extremely high-quality system. I found the best deal on a package at Kempf Gun Shop.

 

[damifinowfish]

I feel that learning a new hobby you should keep it simple. You have a lot going on at one time with the turret press. With everything happening at one time couldn't it get frustrating when something does not turn out right?

With a single stage it is simpler

just my opinion

 

[bmwdan42]

After 40+ years on single station presses, I bought a Hornady auto indexing progressive. I have the micrometer adjuster in the auto powder measure so I can repeat any charge to a tenth grain accuracy. It is 5 station so I have one set up with the powder cop die which gives a visual indication of over or under charge. The dies come out with just a quarter turn twist. I have several thousand .40 s&w and .45 acp that I had sized, primed and neck expanded prior to buying the progressive press. O just POP out the sizer/decapper pick a bullet, set the powder measure and feed it. One new cartridge per stroke. I have selected a powder that works good for various calibers that I load (mostly handgun) so I don't have to change powders very often. Hornady was more expensive than the lee ($380+/-) but it comes with the auto powder measure, both rifle and pistol cylinders and they have a 2012 promo where you get 400 free bullets.