Gerald Ung incident in Philly

[mayor_quimby]

Honestly bottom line simple question : Why did you follow Ung and what did you expect?

How can you believe the testimony from someone who comes out and says they they were drinking "shots and beers for 2 hours" before this altercation. DiDonato story makes no sense. What did they have to gain in following Ung after they made fun of him repeatedly ? What were they expecting once he turned around. Also the line about defusing the situation to stop a sucker punch from happening is a little far fetched to me

 

[traveller]

How can you believe the testimony from someone who comes out and says they they were drinking "shots and beers for 2 hours" before this altercation. DiDonato story makes no sense. What did they have to gain in following Ung after they made fun of him repeatedly ? What were they expecting once he turned around. Also the line about defusing the situation to stop a sucker punch from happening is a little far fetched to me

I dont believe anyone at this point. That is why there is a trial where his witness(es) and his own * testimony in addition to the video evidence will be weighed against the * testimony of the other parties involved in this bar-fight.






*self-serving

 

[Ethan83]

Sure sounds like a troll to me. We're now not supposed to believe our own two eyes, but rather, the admittedly biased story of a drunk guy involved in the fight... gotcha.

 

[traveller]

Sure sounds like a troll to me. We're now not supposed to believe our own two eyes, but rather, the admittedly biased story of a drunk guy involved in the fight... gotcha.

Mh, so everyone who doesn't agree with your point of view must be a troll. Interesting.

Before I make up my mind whether Gerald Ung is a good martyr for concealed carry, I'll wait until the trial is over and the evidence is available in transcripts etc.

Reminds me of the guy who got shot in a Costco in Vegas. For the longest time he was this hero figure, after the death investigation concluded it became pretty clear that he, through his decisions and actions, was the only one to blame for the outcome.

 

[Ethan83]

Mh, so everyone who doesn't agree with your point of view must be a troll. Interesting.

No, it's because you're asking us to discount what we see with our own two eyes.

 

[smokering]

...... involved in this bar-fight.

Sorry, but that was no "bar-fight". The real fact is that no matter what was said earlier, they pursued Ung and his GF, he didn't chase them and "gun someone down". Had they walked across to the other side of the street and left them alone there is a good chance there would have been nothing to read about.

 

[hvymax]

Maybe we have Flyer124 here.

 

[traveller]

No, it's because you're asking us to discount what we see with our own two eyes.

I am asking you to wait until all aspects of the incident become public record. You can still disagree with the juries interpretation of what comes out, but so far all we have a grainy video of the very end of the incident mixed with lots of opinion.

 

[Ethan83]

I am asking you to wait until all aspects of the incident become public record. You can still disagree with the juries interpretation of what comes out, but so far all we have a grainy video of the very end of the incident mixed with lots of opinion.

There is no other relevant info. I don't care if Ung started hostile dialogue himself - he was trying to physically leave the scene, and his attackers pursued him and assaulted him. End of story. There is no other context necessary.

 

[boricuamaximus]

I wouldnt call traveller a troll just that he has a differing view.

However, after seeing the video, I dont care if Ung pooped on the kid's grandma the "victim" should have backed off. Ung was in the right but we know daddy is going to get Ung screwed.

That is why civilization negates darwinism. This kid should have been eaten by wolves long ago.

 

[traveller]

There is no other relevant info. I don't care if Ung started hostile dialogue himself - he was trying to physically leave the scene, and his attackers pursued him and assaulted him. End of story. There is no other context necessary.

It is called 'engaging in mutual combat' and makes a great deal of difference in whether you can claim self-defense. Some of the news reports indicated that Ung 'bumped' one of the drunk fratboys while he was doing chin-ups on some construction scaffolding. Did he provoke the attack ? Don't know, the video doesn't show that.

PA Code Title 18 Chapter 5 § 505 'Use of force in self-protection'

b (2) The use of deadly force is not justifiable under
this section unless the actor believes that such force is
necessary to protect himself against death, serious bodily
injury, kidnapping or sexual intercourse compelled by force
or threat; nor is it justifiable if:
(i) the actor, with the intent of causing death or
serious bodily injury, provoked the use of force against
himself in the same encounter; or

There is another provision that may or may not play into the justification for self defense in this case:


PA Code Title 18 Chapter 5 § 503 'Justification generally'

(b) Choice of evils.--When the actor was reckless or
negligent in bringing about the situation requiring a choice of
harms or evils or in appraising the necessity for his conduct,
the justification afforded by this section is unavailable in a
prosecution for any offense for which recklessness or
negligence, as the case may be, suffices to establish
culpability.


I am genuinely interested to see what comes out at the trial. So far, it seems to illustrate that if you carry, you are well advised to stay out of ANY kind of confrontation to avoid it from escalating into something bad.

Have you read Mas Ayoobs books on the use of lethal force ?

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

Maybe we have another troll for the rich boy.

Intolerant crowd ain't we.

Disagree here and you are a Troll. Maybe some of you should go to DU for a spell.

IMHO the guy was justified and if i was on the jury, I'd keep an open mind.

Bunch of F'n fan boys, mixed in with a heapin helpin' of a mutual admiration society.

Get in lock step or you're a troll . . .

I agree 100% comrade

 

[Inigoes]

Either way when you see the video he's retreating.

http://www.myfoxphilly.com/dpp/news/local_news/Old_City_Shooting_01_17_10

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

Mh, so everyone who doesn't agree with your point of view must be a troll. Interesting.

Before I make up my mind whether Gerald Ung is a good martyr for concealed carry, I'll wait until the trial is over and the evidence is available in transcripts etc.

Reminds me of the guy who got shot in a Costco in Vegas. For the longest time he was this hero figure, after the death investigation concluded it became pretty clear that he, through his decisions and actions, was the only one to blame for the outcome.

Dude, I don't know you and have no idea if you actually are a troll; however - when you gainsay someone here, my lord the pulling of hair and gnashing of teeth can be heard through my cable line. You become the turd in the punchbowl, are villified, and wow - mods allow personal attacks

And heaven forbid a thread gets fiesty - it's locked down tighter than a vestal virgin.

Are we men here, or a bunch of blue haired old ladies? Seriously, I can argue with a guy at AR15, think he's dead wrong and the 2nd biggest a$$ on there (because I am #1) and a week later I am sending him a detent and spring for an AR build.

Web site clique of whinny biatches if you just happen to have an opinion not in line with the majority.

Oh oh - maybe I'll get permabanned for having an opinion

 

[hvymax]

Earlier in this thread we had Flyer 123 appear and defend the thugs and it turned out he was on the PR payroll of richboys dad. Most of us have been following this from the start and seen the video ourselves before the OJ defense team went to work.

 

[Darkemp]

Trolls in our midst...Ung is the victim of his own self defense. I'm watching closely too and will celebrate his acquittal.

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

http://www.myfoxphilly.com/dpp/news/local_news/Old_City_Shooting_01_17_10

Indeed he is; I don't know the guy. Maybe he got a permit after being mugged? maybe he wanted to be a vigalante?

All I can hope for is he gets a fair trial. Like I said - open mind. Toss all the rhetoric aside. if he felt like they were gonna jump him and injure/kill him, I am not 2nd guessing the guy.

ETA: no matter what the situation, someone pulls a gun on me, I am stopping in my tracks. I sure as hell am not walking towards a man with a gun pointed at me. IMHO - the guy who got shot was DRUNK. Nothing else can explain why he continued towards a armed person.

I guess they didn't test his BAC

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

Earlier in this thread we had Flyer 123 appear and defend the thugs and it turned out he was on the PR payroll of richboys dad. Most of us have been following this from the start and seen the video ourselves before the OJ defense team went to work.

No kidding. Maybe we all should start posting comments to the articles in Philly.

I can't stand when some people think they can buy something as rare and hard to find as justice.

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

Trolls in our midst...Ung is the victim of his own self defense. I'm watching closely too and will celebrate his acquittal.

Trolls?? I thought it was just the one guy.

Like I said, I lean heavily towards a "good shoot," but as a juror, would keep an open mind.

 

[Maryland_Shooter]

Just another article:

http://abovethelaw.com/2011/02/commonwealth-v-ung-the-temple-law-student-shooter-goes-to-trial/