Best SHTF firearms solution for the elderly

[teratos]

Rossi Coach Gun in 12 or 20ga, easy to cock hammers, short enough to handle in a hallway.
Beware of Granny with a Shotgun!

Yeah. She’ll break her osteoporotic shoulder. LOL.

 

[NebTim]

LoL... agreed. It checks the "simple" block.

But also checks the "brutal recoil" block.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Yes , it is an important question .

No , there is catagorical answer , because everybody 65yo and over is Not the same . Plenty of reasonably fit old farts can shoot circles around young whippersnappers with any type of firearm , even if not quite as well as in their prime . Conversely plenty of young and middle aged people have physical limitations . And people who went their whole lives without any previous interest or experience , and only seek a bare minimum now , are still another factor .

You can discuss firearms for people with low hand strength or dexterity .

You can discuss firearms for people with low upper body strength generally .

You can discuss firearms for people with balance or mobility issues .

You can discuss firearms for " non dedicated users " , who will only begrudgingly accept a couple of coaching sessions , won't practice of their own volition , and only want/ consent to have one on hand for " just in case " .

You can hash out various combinations of above , but there has to be parameters in place to have a meaningful discussion or problem solving .

 

[Biggfoot44]

Keeping my above post in mind , across several of parameters , a physically lightweight , low to minimal recoil shoulder arm is a tool , with bonus for not having excessively harsh muzzle blast .

Will these be Ultimate Combat Weapons , probably not . Will they also have shortcomings , or at least less than ideal factors ? Probably .

Accept that life isn't always ideal , and make reasonably plausible choices from the available options .

For reasonably healthy non gun people , for whom I would have one , maybe two coaching sessions , and that's it , I used to like Marlin Camp Carbines . Not tacticool , but conventional stocks are more intuitive for non shooters . Camp Carbines are now collectables , but potentially substitute other conventional stocked PCC .

If they are somewhat gun knowledgeable , And still have dexterity , but need to avoid harsh recoil , a lever action , with .38 Spl , or .44 Spl actually loaded . Yes , SASS style .44 Spl in a .44 Mag levergun has mouse fart recoil .

Still lower recoil or physical weight in rifle ? The dreaded Rimfire . Yeah, yeah , particularly in current times .22lr ammo isn't perfect . If a .22lr rifle is otherwise a good solution , use CCI Mini Mag , or expensive target ammo , and realize that 99% ammo reliability is still better than stern looks and harsh language .

With body strength and arthritis issues , the Weight of the gun is as important , or more important than recoil . While reduced recoil 12ga loads can match the recoil of a 20ga , the 20ga Gun is usually lighter .

Still lighter and less recoil in a shotgun ? The dreaded .410 . The Mossberg Bantum is really , really light . Modern state of the art .410 00B and 000B loads don't suck , inside of 20 or 25 yds , when all 3 to 5 pellets maintain chest sized or smaller patterns from a real Shotgun .

Handguns ? Y'all are already discussing them to death . All I'll add here is that Single Action Revolvers have ergonomic advantages with weak fingers . Low capacity , and slow to reload ? 5 or 6 accurate rounds are better than stern looks and harsh words .

 

[babalou]

As always

Keeping my above post in mind , across several of parameters , a physically lightweight , low to minimal recoil shoulder arm is a tool , with bonus for not having excessively harsh muzzle blast .

Will these be Ultimate Combat Weapons , probably not . Will they also have shortcomings , or at least less than ideal factors ? Probably .

Accept that life isn't always ideal , and make reasonably plausible choices from the available options .

For reasonably healthy non gun people , for whom I would have one , maybe two coaching sessions , and that's it , I used to like Marlin Camp Carbines . Not tacticool , but conventional stocks are more intuitive for non shooters . Camp Carbines are now collectables , but potentially substitute other conventional stocked PCC .

If they are somewhat gun knowledgeable , And still have dexterity , but need to avoid harsh recoil , a lever action , with .38 Spl , or .44 Spl actually loaded . Yes , SASS style .44 Spl in a .44 Mag levergun has mouse fart recoil .

Still lower recoil or physical weight in rifle ? The dreaded Rimfire . Yeah, yeah , particularly in current times .22lr ammo isn't perfect . If a .22lr rifle is otherwise a good solution , use CCI Mini Mag , or expensive target ammo , and realize that 99% ammo reliability is still better than stern looks and harsh language .

With body strength and arthritis issues , the Weight of the gun is as important , or more important than recoil . While reduced recoil 12ga loads can match the recoil of a 20ga , the 20ga Gun is usually lighter .

Still lighter and less recoil in a shotgun ? The dreaded .410 . The Mossberg Bantum is really , really light . Modern state of the art .410 00B and 000B loads don't suck , inside of 20 or 25 yds , when all 3 to 5 pellets maintain chest sized or smaller patterns from a real Shotgun .

Handguns ? Y'all are already discussing them to death . All I'll add here is that Single Action Revolvers have ergonomic advantages with weak fingers . Low capacity , and slow to reload ? 5 or 6 accurate rounds are better than stern looks and harsh words .

As always, great info. Also my 89 year old Pop can shoot his SR45 better than i can shoot. Lol

 

[Biggfoot44]

My late FIL in his final years had severe COPD , and his hands shook . He could walk 3 or 4 steps , then have to rest for 5 minutes before another 3 steps .

But he could head shoot a Weasel across a half acre back yard with his revolver .

But he was lifelong shooter , hunter , gunfight veteran with USMC MP's , Bullseye competitor , handloader , and bullet caster , not a rookie .

 

[motorcoachdoug]

There is also the High Point 9mm or 40cal carbine that they use with no trouble and or mabe a 410 shotgun. All 3 would be easy to manage with no trouble. I know from experience that you feed the High Point junk ammo and it will go bang bang each and every time.

 

[teratos]

My late FIL in his final years had severe COPD , and his hands shook . He could walk 3 or 4 steps , then have to rest for 5 minutes before another 3 steps .

But he could head shoot a Weasel across a half acre back yard with his revolver .

But he was lifelong shooter , hunter , gunfight veteran with USMC MP's , Bullseye competitor , handloader , and bullet caster , not a rookie .

What we need to consider is frail older folks as first time gun buyers. There are a lot of factors. I’m not saying OPs folks are frail, but I think it’s an interesting intellectual exercise.

 

[Blacksmith101]

What we need to consider is frail older folks as first time gun buyers. There are a lot of factors. I’m not saying OPs folks are frail, but I think it’s an interesting intellectual exercise.

Opportunity for some gun manufacturer to develop a gun or probably several types of guns for that specific market. Targeted to the first time gun buyer for home defense that are easy (intuitive) to operate, mild recoil, ergonomically friendly, reasonable accuracy at home distances, adequate stopping power, reliable, at moderate cost.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Enter the Home Defense Moss M500 .410 of twenty some years ago . Front pistol grip , " barell device that dressed up a .410 to look like a 12ga muzzle , and the most cringe worthy advertising campaign of all time , which managed to offend and piss off all shooters , male or female , and all women , wether shooters or not .

But I suppose in part it was ahead of its time . At the time they were touting the prowess of the 90gr Foster slug , rather deceptively . ( No I'm not volunteering to get shot with one , but it's pretty lame .) If today's 00B and 000B loads were around , it might have cought on better .

At least nowadays S&W doesn't advertise the E-Z line to the effect of " Hey , all you cripples and weaklings , this one's for You ! " .

 

[Redcobra]

One may think about failing vison. Is this for carry or bedside? One may think more of a shotgun although recoil would be a concern.

All you youngsters and your recoil talk. I'm 75 and shot 4 rounds of trap and two rounds of skeet yesterday with a 12g.

 

[K31]

Yeah. She’ll break her osteoporotic shoulder. LOL.

You can't make an omelet out of some home invader's face without cracking some eggs.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

Great discussion. Lots of thought provoking suggestions.

I’m (still) stuck on the physical and emotional limitations of whomever you intend to arm.

Will and skill are one thing. Physical ability is also a major hurdle.

What person A knows and can and will do is often a far cry from what person X is capable of. Aging is humbling. It’s also grossly inconsistent in what “gifts” it gives to this person vs that person.

Folks talking revolvers as the solution ought consider that person Z does not have hand strength to either: ear back the hammer or pull the trigger in double action for many guns. I wouldn’t have understood this had I not watched my pop struggle repeatedly with just that. No amount of training can substitute for gross physical inability.

Dialog about taking subjects to the range to determine what they’re capable of and comfortable with is the best advice herein; imo. Suffice it to say each subject will enjoy a different, likely tailored solution.

 

[joppaj]

I'll be the *******...

Why a gun? Have you upgraded their doors/ locks/ alarms/ lighting? Do they have a good landline to call for help? Do they live in high crime areas? How do they feel about large dogs? What has changed now to make people around 80 decide that they need a gun for the first time?

We're gun folks. We can argue for days about the perfect gun and the perfect ammo. Sufficient penetration vs over penetration, recoil vs energy, ease of use... Thats our shtick but this is real deal, lives that perceive they're in danger. What has been done to harden the target?

 

[gwchem]

I'll be the *******...

Why a gun? Have you upgraded their doors/ locks/ alarms/ lighting? Do they have a good landline to call for help? Do they live in high crime areas? How do they feel about large dogs? What has changed now to make people around 80 decide that they need a gun for the first time?

We're gun folks. We can argue for days about the perfect gun and the perfect ammo. Sufficient penetration vs over penetration, recoil vs energy, ease of use... Thats our shtick but this is real deal, lives that perceive they're in danger. What has been done to harden the target?

And the two best things you can do to harden the target are:

Move to a very low crime area.
Don't interact with criminals.

 

[Worsley]

I'll be the *******...

Why a gun? Have you upgraded their doors/ locks/ alarms/ lighting? Do they have a good landline to call for help? Do they live in high crime areas? How do they feel about large dogs? What has changed now to make people around 80 decide that they need a gun for the first time?

We're gun folks. We can argue for days about the perfect gun and the perfect ammo. Sufficient penetration vs over penetration, recoil vs energy, ease of use... Thats our shtick but this is real deal, lives that perceive they're in danger. What has been done to harden the target?

Physical security is as good as it can be without adding metal window barriers, both have standard electronic security and ability to contact 911. They do not live in high crime areas but they have lost confidence in the government’s willingness (local, state and federal) to allow law enforcement to do their jobs.

 

[teratos]

I'll be the *******...

Why a gun? Have you upgraded their doors/ locks/ alarms/ lighting? Do they have a good landline to call for help? Do they live in high crime areas? How do they feel about large dogs? What has changed now to make people around 80 decide that they need a gun for the first time?

We're gun folks. We can argue for days about the perfect gun and the perfect ammo. Sufficient penetration vs over penetration, recoil vs energy, ease of use... Thats our shtick but this is real deal, lives that perceive they're in danger. What has been done to harden the target?

Excellent points. When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

I'm still intrigued by the idea of ergonomics that may make firearm ownership more accessible to folks with age related or other limitations. It may be a rabbit hole I go down.

 

[Kman]

I'll be the *******...

Hey! Stay in your lane chief!
That's my job!

 

[Ammo Jon]

Saw these recently. If I wasn’t running out of room I thought they would be a fun addition.
https://www.stoegerindustries.com/tactical-firearms

 

[Bullfrog]

I'm still intrigued by the idea of ergonomics that may make firearm ownership more accessible to folks with age related or other limitations. It may be a rabbit hole I go down.

The best answer is going to be the gyrojet. Very light weight since no sturdy barrel or chamber is required, little to no recoil, easily available.