SB387 "Public Safety - Untraceable Firearms" - The Ban on Private Firearm Making

[Doctor_M]

I feel strangely liberated by their tyranny... that's all I saying.

 

[lazarus]

So how does Haynes v US play into this?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haynes_v._United_States

If I am understanding this correctly, any competent lawyer would get any prohibited person out of any criminal punishment for failing to register *and be in possession of* a ghost gun because that would be a violation of their 5th Amendment rights. Meanwhile, we "assume the position".

Nope. Because it would lack a serial number. If they had an FFL out a serial on it and then failed to register maybe. But otherwise there is no self incrimination going on.

 

[Nickberg500]

Anyone have any leads on newspapers/reporters that would report on Delegate Lopez's lies? Specifically the FFL listing.

I know Bryan P. Sears seems to be a fair reporter.

Just thinking of how we can use this info against them. I don't mind doing the legwork, but maybe the brain-trust here has input on who to contact, what to say (maybe which lies to include), most effectively.

Bonus points if this can be used to pressure Hogan's veto. Might be a good idea if I can get multiple people on here to send the info to the same place. Just an idea.

 

[dblas]

Even "if" Larry were to veto it do they have the votes to override a veto ?

This has been said numerous time IN THIS THREAD....If the Governor Vetoes the bill, it cannot be over ridden in the next session per the Maryland State Constitution.

 

[teratos]

I feel strangely liberated by their tyranny... that's all I saying.

Amen. If I can be of assistance in further liberating your soul, I have many jigs ideas on pathways to fulfillment.

 

[Jim12]

It’s Maryland. The party demographics make everything like this about litigation after the fact. No amount of virtue signaling by the state’s small pockets of conservatism will change the motivation behind the lefty majority’s actions like this. It is an expression of their loathing for us, and they need to be seen punishing us in front of their donors. In this state, it’s as simple as that. Every dime and every minute spent on anything but litigation to counter this sort of thing THRILLS the left, because they know we’re squandering them both.

True. Meanwhile, their own dysfunctional, drug abusing children and selves carry on, separate and apart from those they rule and pretend to help, and whose deep seated problems and ills they project on the rest of society. They should be screaming for help.

 

[dblas]

So no floor vote in the Senate until at least Monday?

One condition filled in the chance FL vetoes.

Now, if it can make it through 30 days (or less) with no reconciliation, that would be major egg on all the politicians. And I doubt they would let that happen.

Yes, indeed, as mentioned upthtead, the (D) are very good rallying their troops when there's rights to be taken away.

While there are 30 calander days left, there are 35 legislative days left. And legislative days is the gam they play on sine die to be able to get stuff done in short order, on the last calander day.

 

[elwojo]

Nope. Because it would lack a serial number. If they had an FFL out a serial on it and then failed to register maybe. But otherwise there is no self incrimination going on.

Disagree. Lacking a serial number means nothing. The Fifth Amendment protects a person from registering an item to the government that would incriminate them. This protection literally extends to the point that the NFA does NOT apply to prohibited persons, and it would similarly NOT apply here.

To be very clear: the moment they say a 77r is required, a prohibited person is exempt from the penalty.

 

[dblas]

That's right

After 3 days it becomes law if he doesn't act right?

6 days while still in session, 30 days after the session ends.

 

[Stoveman]

Anyone have any leads on newspapers/reporters that would report on Delegate Lopez's lies? Specifically the FFL listing.

I know Bryan P. Sears seems to be a fair reporter.

Just thinking of how we can use this info against them. I don't mind doing the legwork, but maybe the brain-trust here has input on who to contact, what to say (maybe which lies to include), most effectively.

Bonus points if this can be used to pressure Hogan's veto. Might be a good idea if I can get multiple people on here to send the info to the same place. Just an idea.

He is, and until the Coof hit I couldn't tell you which way he leaned politically but since it has become clear as day and it's not in our direction and I doubt if he would touch this. Don't get me wrong, if she were caught nekkid with an underage boy (or girl) he would be all over it, but a Delegate lying is just another day in Naptown.

But I might be wrong, hit him up on FB, he's good at responding anyway.

 

[mac1_131]

While there are 30 calander days left, there are 35 legislative days left. And legislative days is the gam they play on sine die to be able to get stuff done in short order, on the last calander day.

Forgot about that. So they still have plenty of time.

 

[teratos]

Forgot about that. So they still have plenty of time.

Plenty.

 

[PowPow]

If it was the intent of MSI to litigate all along why did they help polish this turd? Are they going to guarantee that enactment and enforcement will be delayed for the 4-5 years that it takes to work through the court system?

What they have done is put the notion in people like Hough's head that we are just fine with this gun control and now the Senate bill has "bi-partisan" support.

^+1
I could not have said it better. Nail, hammer, solid hit!

 

[DC-W]

Update: https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...and-sb387-privately-made-firearm-bill-updates

 

[Slackdaddy]

I know a TON of people who I always considered straight lace, by the book people,, And the last 2 years has turned them into "FU People"

Amazing, scary, and liberating.
The scary part is, that facade of "the law is for everyone" has been lifted,, and those in power can do what they want to those not in favor,, has ushered in the era of "the law of the jungle"

I feel strangely liberated by their tyranny... that's all I saying.

 

[esqappellate]

So let me put this to rest. MSI has never supported this bill and still doesn’t. No one should doubt it. I personally spent 12 hours of attorney time writing a 17 page single spaced opposition to it. People should read it. I am pro bono counsel for plaintiffs in the Mont Co ghost gun litigation. That case has consumed about $70,000 of my attorney time THUS FAR. So don’t think MSI has gone soft. That’s BS.

If our efforts did anything, they provided the basis for the favorable amendments that passed JPR. The amended bill is better than the un amended bill and they mean the the House passed bill won’t become law. In particular, the reduction in the possession penalty to a non disqualifying level will protect folks from losing all their guns under federal and state law and going to federal prison for ten years on felon in possession charges. Read our latest email for a detailed discussion of the amendments. Staying out of prison is a good thing IMHO.

The political reality is that kids are ordering kits on line and that makes this politically toxic. The legal reality is that the ATF rule will ban kits and a lot of other unserialized stuff regardless of this bill. The Rs voted for the amended final bill in JPR because that was the express price that the Ds imposed for allowing ANY amendments at all. Welcome to ugly MD politics. The Rs will take heat for it, but in my view it was a politically gutsy call for them. They could have just voted no and the unamended bill would STILL have passed JPR and the Senate. The grabbers have the votes. Everyone on these forums should know that. QED

If it was the intent of MSI to litigate all along why did they help polish this turd? Are they going to guarantee that enactment and enforcement will be delayed for the 4-5 years that it takes to work through the court system?

What they have done is put the notion in people like Hough's head that we are just fine with this gun control and now the Senate bill has "bi-partisan" support.



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[elwojo]

So let me put this to rest. MSI has never supported this bill and still doesn’t. No one should doubt it. I personally spent 12 hours of attorney time writing a 17 page single spaced opposition to it. People should read it. I am pro bono counsel for plaintiffs in the Mont Co ghost gun litigation. That case has consumed about $70,000 of my attorney time THUS FAR. So don’t think MSI has gone soft. That’s BS.

If our efforts did anything, they provided the basis for the favorable amendments that passed JPR. The amended bill is better than the un amended bill and they mean the the House passed bill won’t become law. In particular, the reduction in the possession penalty to a non disqualifying level will protect folks from losing all their guns under federal and state law and going to federal prison for ten years on felon in possession charges. Read our latest email for a detailed discussion of the amendments. Staying out of prison is a good thing IMHO.

The political reality is that kids are ordering kits on line and that makes this politically toxic. The legal reality is that the ATF rule will ban kits and a lot of other unserialized stuff regardless of this bill. The Rs voted for the amended final bill in JPR because that was the express price that the Ds imposed for allowing ANY amendments at all. Welcome to ugly MD politics. The Rs will take heat for it, but in my view it was a politically gutsy call for them. They could have just voted no and the unamended bill would STILL have passed JPR and the Senate. The grabbers have the votes. Everyone on these forums should know that. QED

I agree with your sentiment here. I appreciate your work.

I've read through everything (I think) that you've written, and I haven't seen you mention this yet. I'm of the opinion that the bill's possession charges would not apply to prohibited persons, as per Haynes vs US.

I'm not a lawyer, but you are. Am I interpreting Haynes correctly? If I am, it would be great to have you add on the fact that the person charges will only impact law abiding citizens.

 

[esqappellate]

I agree with your sentiment here. I appreciate your work.

I've read through everything (I think) that you've written, and I haven't seen you mention this yet. I'm of the opinion that the bill's possession charges would not apply to prohibited persons, as per Haynes vs US.

I'm not a lawyer, but you are. Am I interpreting Haynes correctly? If I am, it would be great to have you add on the fact that the person charges will only impact law abiding citizens.

Sorry, Haynes won’t protect you. It is the mere possession that is illegal, not the failure to register. If the possession charge sticks under the original bill, THEN you become a prohibited person under state and federal law. The amended bill avoids that result

 

[Jake4U]

Update: https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...and-sb387-privately-made-firearm-bill-updates

Thanks for all you do, summarizing and posting the latest.

 

[DC-W]

Thanks for all you do, summarizing and posting the latest.

I only wish it were on better news.