Laws on Shooting an attacking dog in Montgomery County?

[breimer273]

Two separate issues in this post. First, I have no idea what the law is, I do know that if my life, family or property (to include livestock) are threatened then I am allowed to use deadly force. If its a dog doing the threatening, and I have to choose between my life/safety or the dogs, I'll tell you what, that dog is gonna be the one getting shot.

The second point is the dog, I have been around dogs all my life, rottweilers even (which by the way have the same reputation as pit bulls as they were a breed that was bred for "killing"). I would NEVER immediately assume that any dog was aggressive based just by the breed. Yes there are breeds out there that are more aggressive by instinct but with proper training will learn to use that aggression appropriately. I have two pups (chessies, which are somewhat aggressive) of my own and if any person or dog or anything tried to hurt them, I would use lethal force to protect their lives as well. I love my dogs. I have had my dogs be protective of me around other dogs. Because I have trained them well, they know that if I am ok, then they are ok.

If I were the OP, I would express my concern to the owner, let them know that you feel their dog is being aggressive and you are afraid that it will get out of hand. If that doesn't change anything then report the dog to Animal Control. I would also be ever vigilant whenever that dog is outside.

 

[smokering]

Best I can say is the same I'd say if you had a neighbor who displayed possible violent tendencies towards you; document it. Use your camera video to capture the dog lunging at the fence or better yet have someone capture it to show you are doing nothing to provoke the dog. Bring video of several incidents to animal control and ask them if there is anything you or they can do and have them give you an incident report. They may be more receptive if they don't have to come out to "investigate" without evidence.

 

[Jimet]

Unless your frail Ma likes stompin around out in the snow and slush and freezing cold, I'm guessing these frightening events took place 4-5 months ago. In that time, you haven't had an opportunity to express your concerns to your neighbor ? Don't speak to them because of the way they pay their rent? You should get an att. lined up, unless you start thinking like an adult, you will need one.

 

[HeatSeeker]

That's what you read into it. What I took away was someone who is not comfortable around dogs, or just this particular dog and that may have to do with the certain breed of this dog.

If you have to ask at what point it is "legal" to defend yourself, then you likely have other issues at work. As far as being in this exact situation, there is a long way to go between a dog barking and acting aggressive on the other side of a fence and having to shoot a dog for mauling yourself or a family member.

I disagree. Obviously the dog is acting in a manner in which the OP is afraid it wants to come over the fence after someone or something and I think he would feel the same way if it was a Rotweiler, German Sheppard, Doberman, etc. Not just because it is a Pit Bull. Now given the FACT that Pit Bulls are notorious for attacking people and other animals much more than any other breed that might cause a little more hightened state of imminent danger.

How would you feel if all summer long while trying to enjoy time in your yard, you had to deal with this?

 

[Doobie]

Throw the dog a bone or doggie treat Maybe its jumping at the fence and gnashing its teeth is a "cry" for food. I use to own dogs (Coon hounds, Blue Heelers and Australian shepherds) so I can not comment on pit bulls. If it were me, I'd throw it a treat and try to make friends with it. Like many others said, if it got over the fence, I would do what I had to do to protect myself and/or family. However a firearm would be the very last resort due to the state you live in and the fact that you have neighbors/houses very close who could be hit by a stray round or even a round that hits the dog and exits. How about a collapsible baton or ball bat? I understand where you are coming from and your concerns OP, and if you lived somewhere else or out in the country, things might be different. Truth is animals and criminals have more rights in the state of MD than good, upstanding law abiding citizens. If it were me, I'd try the treats, carry bear spray or a baton/ball bat. I'm not a lawyer and can't/won't give you legal advice.

 

[Docster]

I'm a dog lover and don't hide that.

OP, I guess my question is why even post this? If a dog attacks your kids/mom/lover/whomever, do you care what they laws are? I wouldn't. If a large dog was attacking me or my family on my property, I'd intervene and deal with the consequences later. I mean, you're not going to let your Mother die because of some weasel politician in MoCo, are you? Didn't think so.

If that's the case, then stop premeditating and trying to justify some sort of preemptive action. The dog is doing what dogs do (bark and growl at strangers that are contemplating killing them), AND it's behind a fence on the dog's property. Just maintain situational awareness and carry on. Don't let irrational fears get the best of you.

Finally! A rational, reality-based answer that directly addresses the OPs question without getting tangential, obnoxious and offensive.

 

[jmiller320]

I hear what you're saying, that's a good point.

How about carrying a concealed and loaded gun on my own property w/o a permit? I am allowed to do so and all the way up to the where my front lawn touches the sidewalk, right?

No. Your property extends to your lot line. Some of your front yard may be in the right of way. You need to know where your property lines are located.

 

[safecracker]

It's been apparent in my experience that many people rely on this chart in order to identify dog breeds.

 

[souprcampbell]

/Rant on...

So Pit Bulls are notorious for attacking humans? Or maybe just that stout larger breed dogs are reported as such? Ever been bitten by a Jack Russel? Would that Jack Russel's incident be reported just as a Rott or Pit? Sort of like how criminal shootings are often reported on a soap box, but a lawful UoF by a concealed carry citizen is swept under the rug?

It is okay for us to consider ourselves knowledgable on this forum about firearms, and to understand that one of our biggest duties is educating folks about them in order to break down the fear wall that leads to uneducated people wanting to ban such things? But when we talk about another subject that more than a few members here are obviously ignorant on, they can fear monger and throw out ridiculous "facts" such as being bred to kill, and have long histories of attacking humans and "most" insurance companies will not "cover them?"

Can you show these "facts" and cite them before we go full retard and talk about how your personal requirement to defend yourself from an animal due to how it looks includes proactively solving the problem by shooting the dog? Go ahead and throw your Evil Black Rifles into the ban pile (they're scary looking), along with sharp sticks and people who frown at you... because they're scary too and you don't understand them. Lets ban muscle cars and trucks with big mud tires because they're aggressive. Ban tannerite, oh it already is? Thank your elected Reps for limiting what a well intentioned individual can do/buy/say without justification. Okay, lets say we don't ban certain breeds, but now you have to prove why you want that breed. Go ahead and provide a Good & Substantial reason of why you want a type of dog and see how far that gets you.

Do you see the relation yet? We are supposed to be better than this. A discussion on this forum about protecting yourself? Okay, sure. A discussion on county/state laws on self defense and how it coincides with human/animals? Gas it up and burn it down, lets see where the facts lead us. Steering people into tin foil hat paranoia and touting unsubstantiated misinformation that your heard from a guy once who told a story about dogs? We hurt ourselves with this banter. Information and education is our strength here.

\Rant off

 

[Second Amendment]

Only the police are allowed to shoot dogs.

 

[MikeTF]

Only the police are allowed to shoot dogs.

(I'm joking) ... should he SWAT his neighbor?

 

[Redcobra]

How about a Ninja Sword. Electrify the fence? Cattle Prod?

 

[Jarhead FLSTI]

Dogs that bark and growl from behind a fence don't bother me at all. They are doing what dogs do... warn you that you're encroaching on their property. Dogs that bark, growl and act aggressive when they're out on a leash or roaming free is totally different.

My neighbor has a pit bull that goes bat shit crazy when we're near the fence. If she gets loose (which happens quite a bit because the kid leaves the gate open), the dog is the most submissive gentle dog I've seen. She will drop to the ground and piss herself when I catch her and drag her home.

I have an Akita that will not bark unless someone is right next to my fence. If they get too close you would think he's the most ferocious dog in the world. When I take him out, he's the friendliest attention whore you'll ever see. He wants EVERYONE to play with him including cats and other dogs.

I would be rather pissed if someone shot my dog if he got out of my yard "because he was aggressive behind the fence". Thankfully all of my neighbors know the dog and know that he'll only be aggressive on "his" property.

You should have a talk with your neighbor about introducing the dog (on leash) to you and your family to see how it behaves when it's not "protecting". You may find that the dog is really friendly and outgoing. If the dog still shows aggression even while on a leash, then be concerned.

 

[montoya32]

 

[Mr Bear]

So what is the OP going to do? Sit on the porch with his gun and play sentry whenever someone wants to go out into the yard??

Has granny expressed a concern about the dog? Is she going to be "strapped" in the yard as well?

If the dog stays on your neighbor's side of the fence, then deal with it. I'm sorry your neighbors suck. If it comes OVER the fence, then you do what you have to do. But it's not going to be as easy as just "opening fire". If this is a problem, you have a small yard. By the time you draw and are ready to shoot, the dog is going to probably be wherever it's going to be, and it's your liability if you try to shoot and hit granny by mistake. Assuming the dog isn't already on YOU and you even get a CHANCE to shoot.

Has the dog ever jumped the fence before? Has it ever shown a predisposition to do so?

Do you have a working relationship at ALL with your neighbors? If so, you should at least speak to them.

As for the whole "pit bull" debate...yes, a disproportionately high number of pitbulls are involved in "mauling" cases. Just like the proportion of inmates who are minorities is higher than in un-incarcerated society. What are you trying to say? This is one dog. And it sounds like the problem, again, is more about the owner than the animal. Much of the aggression has actually been bred OUT of pit bulls since dogfighting has become illegal, but it's still there to some degree. As an owner, you can either behave in a way that brings it out (let the dog assume dominance, or "push it" to be violent and defensive) or you can behave in a way that suppresses it, with proper discipline, exercise, and affection.

I'll admit, when I was living in East Baltimore suburbia, if I saw someone walking with a "bully" dog NOT on a leash, I would think about how irresponsible that person was being, and what I would do if the dog would suddenly "break bad". But that's just being safe...I'm not scared to death and I'm not thinking about "when deadly force is authorized". It's actually kind of irresponsible to walk ANY dog in a public place without a leash. When I was out in the country, I didn't much care for "porch dogs", the ones that had free run of the farm and would come romping out to the road to check me and my dog out.

In the OP's case, though, the dog is fenced in. So the owner is exercising a modicum of responsibility. It sounds to me like speculation that the dog has the ability or inclination to "jump the fence"...if it wanted to jump the fence and come after people, it would have done it already, in which case the OP would already have a case with animal control.

So really, the issue is not the neighbor's dog. It is the OP's estimation of whether his neighbor's fence is adequate to contain the dog.

If the OP believes that the fence is inadequate, maybe the OP needs to build a TALLER fence in his OWN yard for protection.

Or talk to the neighbor, if the neighbor is civil.

Or call the police, if he believes his neighbor is not adequately containing the animal.

Or move.

My point is that there are several effective options for managing this situation that don't involve shooting.

In a crisis, where severe bodily harm is imminent or already underway...you do what you have to do...but it may not be the best "Plan A".

It's not only irresponsible, but is against the law to have any dog off-leash that's not on its own property. I constantly see people with their dogs off-leash in parks & areas where it is not allowed. I don't want any off-leash dogs approaching my on-leash dogs. Some folks think laws/rules don't apply to them.

I think it's a good idea to meet the dogs on-leash, but off their property to see how they behave with strangers. Many dogs are protective of their respective properties but are totally different away from home if they've been trained & socialized. However, as has already been stated, many owners do their dogs a great disservice by not learning about owning dogs, breed traits, or socialization, from the huge amount of info that's available. Do folks know how to properly introduce strange humans or pets to their dogs? My guess is most folks don't, hence we have problems.

I think discharging a firearm, even in a small yard is asking for tons of trouble in Md. About 2 yrs ago, DC opted not to prosecute a resident for shooting a dog that attacked a child on the sidewalk. Md might respond differently & make an example of a shooter.

I've always been a fan of good strong, tall, reinforced fences to keep my guys in & other dogs/people out. I also walk my guys equipped with pepper spray, a folding knife, & a heavy duty 6 ft tall walking stick. So far I've only had to use the stick once, on a boxer (it wasn't a love tap either). As we're taught in our training, I was going to stop the threat.

 

[BlackBart]

http://6abc.com/news/pit-bull-in-ne-phila-attack-accused-of-violent-history/567388/

http://www.katv.com/story/28579514/man-dies-after-pit-bull-attack-in-pine-bluff

Today........... IN the news.

 

[BlackBart]

I would sue the piss out of that shelter. That they would re-adopt that dog after it had already shown aggression, AND advertise it as being good with kids, is downright irresponsible. I know some local shelters will not adopt dogs with aggressive histories to anyone except rescues.

Beyond that, your thinking is no different than, "Adam Lanza shoots up a kindergarten with a semi-auto rifle, so we should ban semi-auto rifles". I have a bunch in my safe that have never killed anyone, and are reasonably "well-behaved". Why should mine be "put down" because someone else's caused some problems?

And there is very little in either article to indicate how the owners treated the dogs. Who the hell adopts a pitbull and then lets their elementary-age kids play with it 2 days later?? If you adopt ANY dog it should be "decompressed" for at least a week or so while it adjusts to the new environment and you get an idea of its TRUE temperment. (which is NOT apparent when the dog has been in the pound for any stint of time)

Dogs are one of those things most people don't like to admit that they're relatively ignorant about. You can get away with some things with a new puppy that has no "history". A rescue, especially of a bully-breed, needs to be treated with a little more care, especially when children are involved.



Once again...who the hell has seven pitbulls AND a shoddy fence? Someone who obviously does not give a damn, and should probably not have ANY dogs, ever.

Congratulations on finding the most hyperbolically ridiculous example possible.

These idiots obviously did, sadly many think pitbulls are no different than any other breed. Those that think the OP's concerns are invalid fall into hat category. He came here with a legit problem only to be told basically he should mind his own business. Well guess what.... it IS his business and concern.

 

[outrider58]

Can someone help me out? Do I have to get attacked and actually be bitten first before I can legally shoot a neighbor's dog?

I would only shoot the dog in the event of a prolonged attack...on anyone. Not just because it nipped me.

Can we dispense of all this other bullchit? OP is not attacking all pitbulls. He asked a very directed question. About one particular dog. It just happened to be a pitbull.

 

[BlackBart]

Can someone help me out? Do I have to get attacked and actually be bitten first before I can legally shoot a neighbor's dog?

I would only shoot the dog in the event of a prolonged attack...on anyone. Not just because it nipped me.

Can we dispense of all this other bullchit? OP is not attacking all pitbulls. He asked a very directed question. About one particular dog. It just happened to be a pitbull.

Depending on the county I think, Wicomico by comparison s VERY gun friendly compared to the shitty DC part of Md.

 

[Second Amendment]

(I'm joking) ... should he SWAT his neighbor?

Have the cops show up on bikes with no warrant.