SHTF- In his own words

[Blacksmith101]

That's what I was getting at earlier. If we don't have beef, poultry, or pork around and everyone is eating deer without any management how long do you think they will last? 1-2 years?

"Former CIA director James Woolsey testified before the U.S. Senate in 2015 that, if America’s electric grid were to go down for an extended period, such as one year, “there are essentially two estimates on how many people would die from hunger, from starvation, from lack of water, and from social disruption.

“One estimate is that within a year or so, two-thirds of the United States population would die,” Mr. Woolsey said. “The other estimate is that within a year or so, 90 percent of the U.S. population would die.”

Chris Keefer, president of Canadians for Nuclear Energy, concurred."

Link:

 

[Ponder_MD]

I may be naive but I don't agree with Woolsey's assessment. People will step up and farm, raise animals and vegetables in unconventional ways in unconventional places.

Yes, millions will die but 90%? What does he think people did before air-conditioning and Wal-Mart? We'll figure it out.

 

[Archeryrob]

I would say the majority of people live in city like areas and have no idea how to feed themselves without a supermarket. Hell, a huge percentage of the people can't even cook from scratch any more. If its not pre-made, they going hungry. But yes, 90% would include 2/3rds of all the country people also and seems way too high. Look how snow storms crush grocery stores. 3 days in they will be stripped. 1 week in, or less, the populated area will begin to attack each other for food.

"Former CIA director James Woolsey testified before the U.S. Senate in 2015 that, if America’s electric grid were to go down for an extended period, such as one year, “there are essentially two estimates on how many people would die from hunger, from starvation, from lack of water, and from social disruption.

“One estimate is that within a year or so, two-thirds of the United States population would die,” Mr. Woolsey said. “The other estimate is that within a year or so, 90 percent of the U.S. population would die.”

Chris Keefer, president of Canadians for Nuclear Energy, concurred."

Link:

Mr Woolsey. I remember him on Star Gate.

 

[28Shooter]

I may be naive but I don't agree with Woolsey's assessment. People will step up and farm, raise animals and vegetables in unconventional ways in unconventional places.

Yes, millions will die but 90%? What does he think people did before air-conditioning and Wal-Mart? We'll figure it out.

There were a lot less people then who lived on larger lots/properties with their own wells and septic systems which made them a lot more independent...think about, if the public water system goes down - stops, what do you do in urban/suburban areas for water? Water is life.

 

[Bountied]

There were a lot less people then who lived on larger lots/properties with their own wells and septic systems which made them a lot more independent...think about, if the public water system goes down - stops, what do you do in urban/suburban areas for water? Water is life.

Water, food, oxygen, all pretty important. Oxygen is probably #1.

 

[Blacksmith101]

Water, food, oxygen, all pretty important. Oxygen is probably #1.

3 minutes without oxygen, 3 days without water, 3 weeks without food.

 

[Mark75H]

I may be naive but I don't agree with Woolsey's assessment. People will step up and farm, raise animals and vegetables in unconventional ways in unconventional places.

95% of the population doesn't know conventional farming much less unconventional.

Yes, millions will die but 90%? What does he think people did before air-conditioning and Wal-Mart? We'll figure it out.

Almost all of those people are already dead. From my experience working in the heat, 90%+ would prefer to lay down and die rather than working in the heat.

 

[Ponder_MD]

I love the heat. I struggle with the cold.

 

[Blacksmith101]

Most people do not know:
How to make water safe to drink.
Could not make a fire to boil water.
Skin and dress any game animal.
Cut down a tree without a chainsaw.

 

[Mark75H]

Most people do not know:
How to make water safe to drink.
Could not make a fire to boil water.
Skin and dress any game animal.
Cut down a tree without a chainsaw.

Most people don't know how to cut down a tree WITH a chainsaw

 

[Archeryrob]

I got to be honest and I'd say 80%+ plus of hunters don't know how to butcher a deer and 90%+ don't know how to preserve it without a freezer. Even many outdoors people don't know what they should.

Cutting down a tree with a bow saw is a lot of work! I've done that before. My F-n-L gave me a old wood cutting saw from his forestry days. I'll post a pic, but have not used it yet as the Husqvarna rancher 450 is easier to use.

 

[Bountied]

Most people do not know:
How to make water safe to drink. Iodine tablets, filtering, boiling.
Could not make a fire to boil water. Matches/lighter and tinder. Or several other methods.
Skin and dress any game animal. Deer to doves. Turtles are harder...
Cut down a tree without a chainsaw. Axe or saw, ram it with a truck.

I know how to do all of those! I am winning!

 

[Ponder_MD]

My wife can field dress and skin a deer. We'd waste a lot of meat on the first couple of butcherings but would probably get better...if we survived long enough. I can fish. Ironically, the invasive fish (blue catfish and snakehead) in the bay would feed people for a fair while before they are decimated.

 

[Archeryrob]

Meat is not wasted unless left on the bones when discarded. My daughter used to get sloppy and I told her the sloppier she gets the more ground we have and the less steaks and roast.

I've never bought #2 cure and hung casings to try preserving them and maybe I should. I think you need a certain percentage of fat to have to remain pliable to eat. I don't have a curing chamber or root cellar to hang them in. Could try smoking/cooking and then hanging, but would have to research it. I cured and smoke goose breasts and dried them tied hanging from a joist. It did not go bad, mold or anything else. It was rather tough, hard and not very enjoyable at all. Survival food at best only. Just observations as only ground meat is saved like that except ham which has a high percentage of fat.

 

[Ponder_MD]

IF you manage to hold on to some sort of structure as shelter and the stuff inside it, a pressure canner can be used over a fire to can meats. I realize that's a lot of "ifs."

The pressure canner isn't really the problem, it's the glass jars and supply of lids.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

Most of the deer are in rural areas and most of the "hunters" are located in urban areas. People in rural areas will not be happy when "city folk" come out to harvest "their" deer and a lot of hunters will not return to their urban homes.

Be a whole new paradigm. Harvests will be more “inclusive.”

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

I think if I need to ground deer and mix it with deer tallow, i'm going to get skinny until I get used to it.. Deer fat might keep you alive, but it not very plateable. I'll say this, I have rendered deer fat that has been in a plastic sealed bag on top the basement fridge for three years and is just fine.

I cooked from flank strips off a buck when rendering out the fat. Saw a piece looked like a nice fat meat/bacon strip. So I started eating it and the fat just coated my entire mouth.

I tried saving beef tallow and had it grow mold in the fridge.


We've talked and our properties all border each other.

Consider suet…

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

I may be naive but I don't agree with Woolsey's assessment. People will step up and farm, raise animals and vegetables in unconventional ways in unconventional places.

Yes, millions will die but 90%? What does he think people did before air-conditioning and Wal-Mart? We'll figure it out.

Chow
Medicine. Especially for those whose life depends on their meds. Think diabetes and high BP.
Machines that assist living. CPAP. Dialysis. Etc
Mental emotional. Suicide will join lack of Will to live in decimating populations.
Killing each other. Any reason. But reasons will abound and multiply.
Inability to live without “normal” creature comforts.
Stupidity. Never underestimate how dumb folks have really become.
Fires. Burning stuff to heat or cook will invariably result in lethal fires.

The list is almost endless. There’s folks who model this stuff for dissertations. Others do mortality estimation for a living.

IDK what the number or percent is but I’m guessing really high.

 

[Blacksmith101]

Chow
Medicine. Especially for those whose life depends on their meds. Think diabetes and high BP.
Machines that assist living. CPAP. Dialysis. Etc
Mental emotional. Suicide will join lack of Will to live in decimating populations.
Killing each other. Any reason. But reasons will abound and multiply.
Inability to live without “normal” creature comforts.
Stupidity. Never underestimate how dumb folks have really become.
Fires. Burning stuff to heat or cook will invariably result in lethal fires.

The list is almost endless. There’s folks who model this stuff for dissertations. Others do mortality estimation for a living.

IDK what the number or percent is but I’m guessing really high.

Lack of sanitation will cause the return of many waterborne diseases that although once common are hardly seen today in this country. These have killed more people than all the wars combined.

Cholera

Dysentery

Typhoid fever

Hepatitis

Etc.

Link to water born disease:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterborne_diseases

 

[Bountied]

Lack of sanitation will cause the return of many waterborne diseases that although once common are hardly seen today in this country. These have killed more people than all the wars combined.

Cholera

Dysentery

Typhoid fever

Hepatitis

Etc.

Link to water born disease:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterborne_diseases

Yet somehow we are still here.